Leonard Cohen covering someone else's songs?

tom.d.stiller · Post by **tom.d.stiller** » Tue Dec 14, 2004 9:00 am

Bobbie wrote:We can't forget the duet with Elton John... "Born To Lose". I don't remember who wrote it, though.

"Born To Lose", I think, was copyrighted by Frankie Brown in 1943, and has been performed by practically every major Crooner and/or Country artist there is (or was). It can rightfully be considered as a "Country Classic".

The original recording, as far as my humble knowledge goes, is by "Ted Daffan and his Texans" in 1943 - a million seller at that time.

Tom

tomsakic · Post by **tomsakic** » Tue Dec 14, 2004 12:51 pm

I always thought that LC was familiar with Born To Lose because of famous Ray Charles performance.

tom.d.stiller · Post by **tom.d.stiller** » Tue Dec 14, 2004 1:51 pm

Ray Charles recorded "Born To Lose" as "late" as 1962. I believe Leonard will have known that song well before that. Someone forming a C&W band in the early Fifties probably couldn't miss all of the old recordings.

More information about "Ted Daffan and his Texans"

Bobbie · Post by **Bobbie** » Tue Dec 14, 2004 11:54 pm

Thanks Tom..... I knew it was an old song, and turns out it's even older than me! (but not by much) Not sure if I remember hearing it before the Ray Charles version. I wonder if Van Morrison does a version of it... sounds like it would be a good one for him to cover.

B

linda_lakeside · Post by **linda_lakeside** » Wed Dec 15, 2004 1:33 am

It's tough to beat Ray Charles, G~d bless him.

tomsakic · Post by **tomsakic** » Wed Dec 15, 2004 11:08 am

I think Johny Cash covered that song many times.
You're right, tom, particularly knowing about the 50s musical context which seems Leonard enjoyed very much

Well, I wonder about this one - where he learned for Be For Real? Written by Frederick Knight, it was perfomed in 1976 by less known Marlena Shaw on her album Just a Matter of Time. According to AMG, she was on Blue Note label, but they didn't know how to make something of her so she more or less disapeared although her promising talent. (Btw, she still regularly works and - compared by AMG to other Blue Note artists - seems very interesting artist.)
The song was later covered only by Leonard, and then in 1996 by the Afghan Wighs.

lizzytysh · Post by **lizzytysh** » Wed Dec 15, 2004 5:01 pm

Tom

!

How could you!?!

" . . . particularly knowing about the 50s musical context which seems Leonard enjoyed very much

."

"

"

Tom!

That's my era, Tom

I also enjoy that musical context very much.

[Sniffing with crushed feelings

],
Lizzy

tomsakic · Post by **tomsakic** » Wed Dec 15, 2004 5:24 pm

I also enjoy it, lizzytysh! I didn't mean anything wrong by that! It was for sure better deacde than: seventies, eighties. Maybe ven nineties. Oh yes, and the nineties, Leonard was in monastery

What I meant is that really Leonard musically was formed on 50s, from country, Frankie Lane, all music he mentions etc. I think that Go No More A-Roving is good proof of that - that's for me great 50ish (?) R&B crooning song.

lizzytysh · Post by **lizzytysh** » Wed Dec 15, 2004 5:31 pm

Ohhhhhh, okay, Tom

. All's forgiven

.

Yes, the nineties boded well by what Leonard was learning elsewhere.

~ Happy Lizzy

tomsakic · Post by **tomsakic** » Wed Dec 15, 2004 5:31 pm

Ahm the

is the guilty? What does he means: "rolling eyes"? I didn't know that's bad, it seems pretty cool and just a little teasing, like hibryd of

and

Well, now I see that

is "shocked". I always use that little being as "shocked-and-very-good-hearted". I like little - how to call that - creatures very much, I guess I got that from my girlfriend who adores all kinds of teddy-bears and all such animals. (Harry Potter's Hedwig is one of our favorites, but that confused Nerval-guy is also cute). So this

and

are my favorite cute dwarfs here

(again that) The simple smiling faces are too simple for me, not so cute as these ones.

lizzytysh · Post by **lizzytysh** » Wed Dec 15, 2004 5:35 pm

Ah, yes. For me, the

can be teasing, mock, or even true shock.

The

can be teasing, or even a diminishing kind of rolling eyes.....a way of criticizing something, suggesting something is 'unworthy' somehow.

tomsakic · Post by **tomsakic** » Wed Dec 15, 2004 5:41 pm

lizzytysh wrote:The can be teasing, or even a diminishing kind of rolling eyes.....a way of criticizing something, suggesting something is 'unworthy' somehow.

Yes, I know that, it's usual saying even that someone "rolls his/her eyes", probably thinking you're under someone's aforethought level.
Imust be careful in the future

lizzytysh · Post by **lizzytysh** » Wed Dec 15, 2004 6:08 pm

" . . . probably thinking you're under someone's aforethought level." That's a good way of putting it, too.

~greg · Post by **~greg** » Mon Jun 20, 2005 6:54 am

In the liner notes to "Greatest Hits" LC said this about "The Partisan":

I learned this from a friend when I was 15.
He was 17. His father was a union organizer.
We were working at a camp in Ste Margeite, Quebec.
We sang together every morning, going through
the People's Song Book from cover to cover.
I developed the curious notion that the Nazis
were overthrown by music.

"The People's Song Book" is out of print.

I asked a few news groups for a list of its
contents and didn't get anywhere, until yesterday.

Someone sent me a link to http://www.alibris.com
where a used copy of the People's Song Book
is being sold with this blurb:

People's Song Book. Includes;
Go Down Moses; Kevin Barry; Star Spangled Banner;
Union Man; Solidarity; Strange Fruit; Jim Crow
by Hille, Waldemar Ed (Lomax, Alan Foreword
Botkin, B.A. Preface ...)

So now I know that LC probably did learn "Kevin Barry"
from the People's Song Book.

Other copies of the book can be found via
http://www.bookfinder.com

And I finally order one.

Until it comes, Google gets one hit for:
"people's song book" "kevin barry"

namely:
http://wolfram.schneider.org/allegro/bac/p/peo.html

(Which seems to me to be a page of test data
for somebody's internet bibliographic-database search system.)

Whatever it is, its entry for "The people's song book"
has mistakes.

For example,
"Peat bot soldiers."
should be
"Peat bog soldiers".

A post in uk.music.folk says this about
"Peat bog soldiers":

The People's Song Book printed in 1948 says
that the song is a German Concentration camp song.
The music is "As notated by Hans Eisler"

"Political prisoners, who composed this song
while marching to and from their work in the peat bog,
sang it with such enthusiasm, particularly
in the last chorus with its veiled meaning,
that it was finally forbidden."

So "Peat bog soldiers" is probably one of the ones that gave LC his "curious notion".

---------------

The following is (apparently, more or less)
the contents of "The People's Song Book".

And while there probably aren't many recordings of it,
LC did cover these, all, once, (-"cover to cover".)

These are LC's earliest studies in folk-music,
and it should be interesting to us to get to know them better.

A dollar ain't a dollar anymore
A-roving
Abe Lincoln
Acres of clams
Ah, poor bird
Beans, bacon and gravy
Beloved comrade
Blck, brown and white blues
Careless love
Chee lai
Cindy
Come, fellow workers
Diny die
Domovina
East Virginia
Everything is higher
Get thee behind me, satan
Go down, Moses
Goin' down the road
Halleluja, 'm a-travelin
Hard travelin
Harry bridges
Haul away, Joe
He's a fool
Hey ho, nobody home
Hey! Zhankoye
Hold the fort
Horse with a union label
I don't want your millions, mister
I'm a-looking for a home
I'm on my way
Investigator's song
It's my union
Jefferson and liberty
Jim Crow
Joe Hill
John Brown's body
John Henry
Joshua fit the battle of Jericho
Kevin Barry
La Marseillaise
Lift every voice and sing
Listen, Mister Bilbo
Los cuatro generales
Meadowland
Midnight special
Mister congressman
Newspapermen
Oh Mary, dont' you weep
Oh, freedom
Oh, joy upon the earth
On top of old Smoky
Paddy works on the railway
Peat bog soldiers [---was: Peat bot soldiers - an error]
Picket line Priscilla
Pity the downtrodden landlord
Poor Mister Morgan
Put it on the ground
Reuben James
Rich man and the poor man
Roll the union on
Round and round the picket line
Schwab, schwab
Slavery's chain
So long, it's been good to know you
Solidarity
Song of the french partisan
Song of the pennies
Soup song
Star spangled banner
Strange fruit
Take this hammer
Talking atomic blues
Talking union
Tarrier's song
The blue tail fly
The dodger song
The farmer is a man
The farmer-labor train
The holly and the ivy
The ploughboy
The scabs crawl
The union man
The union train
The union way
There are three brothers
Union maid
United front
United Nations
Viva la quince brigada
Walk in peace
Wanderin
We got to all get together
We shall not be moved
Which side are you on
Whole wide world around
Worried man blues
You gotta go down
Zum, gali, gali

linda_lakeside · Post by **linda_lakeside** » Mon Jun 20, 2005 8:40 am

~greg,

My goodness! You certainly uncovered some interesting stuff. I always loved "The Partisan" and have wondered about the Peoples Song Book".

I think, all i can say, is thanks.

Linda.