love itself is gone, or maybe was never there
love itself is gone, or maybe was never there
leonard once wrote a song called 'i was never any good at loving you', but surely a person cannot be 'good' or 'bad' at loving someone - can they? to me, the fact that a person can even make such a statement proves that in love they certainly were not. truth cannot be compromised, pregnancy cannot be slight, and love cannot be up or down graded. maybe i've lived a sheltered life, but i have never heard of anyone being given marks out of ten for the quality of their love. it simply is not a divisible concept.
Re: love itself is gone, or maybe was never there
I was never any good at loving you
I was never any good at coming
Through for you
You’re going to feel much better
When you cut me loose forever
I was never any good
Never any good
I was never any good at loving you
I was dying when we met
I bet my life on you
But you called me and I folded
Like you knew I’d do
You called my ace, my king, my bluff
Okay, you win, enough’s enough
I was never any good
Never any good
I was never any good at loving you
I was pretty good at taking out
The garbage
Pretty good at holding up the wall
Dealing with the fire and the earthquake
But that don’t count
That don’t count
That don’t count for nothing much at all
I was never any good at loving you
I was just a tourist in your bed looking
At the view
But I can’t forget where my lips
Have been
Those holy hills, that deep ravine
I was never any good
Never any good
I was never any good at loving you
I was pretty good at taking out the garbage
Pretty good at holding up the wall
I’m sorry for my crimes against
The moonlight
I didn’t think
I didn’t think
I didn’t think the moon would mind at all
I was never any good at loving you
At doing what a woman really wants
A man to do
You’re going to feel much better
When you cut me loose forever
I was never any good
Never any good
I was never any good at loving you
MORE BEST OF LEONARD COHEN
October, 1997
I was having a look at the lyrics and wondered when they were written
Two interesting lines
"But you called me and I folded
Like you knew I’d do" and
"At doing what a woman really wants
A man to do"
My guess is that maybe he was trying to opt out of this particular relationship or was going through a period of self loathing
I was never any good at coming
Through for you
You’re going to feel much better
When you cut me loose forever
I was never any good
Never any good
I was never any good at loving you
I was dying when we met
I bet my life on you
But you called me and I folded
Like you knew I’d do
You called my ace, my king, my bluff
Okay, you win, enough’s enough
I was never any good
Never any good
I was never any good at loving you
I was pretty good at taking out
The garbage
Pretty good at holding up the wall
Dealing with the fire and the earthquake
But that don’t count
That don’t count
That don’t count for nothing much at all
I was never any good at loving you
I was just a tourist in your bed looking
At the view
But I can’t forget where my lips
Have been
Those holy hills, that deep ravine
I was never any good
Never any good
I was never any good at loving you
I was pretty good at taking out the garbage
Pretty good at holding up the wall
I’m sorry for my crimes against
The moonlight
I didn’t think
I didn’t think
I didn’t think the moon would mind at all
I was never any good at loving you
At doing what a woman really wants
A man to do
You’re going to feel much better
When you cut me loose forever
I was never any good
Never any good
I was never any good at loving you
MORE BEST OF LEONARD COHEN
October, 1997
I was having a look at the lyrics and wondered when they were written
Two interesting lines
"But you called me and I folded
Like you knew I’d do" and
"At doing what a woman really wants
A man to do"
My guess is that maybe he was trying to opt out of this particular relationship or was going through a period of self loathing
Re: love itself is gone, or maybe was never there
lonndubh wrote the lyrics to a Leonard Cohen song:
>"I can’t forget where my lips have been, those holy hills, that deep ravine."
interesting rhetoric. note the adjective describing the ravine. he says it was "deep". a psychologist might interpret this as meaning he was incapable of reaching the bottom - and that might explain why he felt he "was never any good". not all men are well endowed, remember.
>"I can’t forget where my lips have been, those holy hills, that deep ravine."
interesting rhetoric. note the adjective describing the ravine. he says it was "deep". a psychologist might interpret this as meaning he was incapable of reaching the bottom - and that might explain why he felt he "was never any good". not all men are well endowed, remember.
Re: love itself is gone, or maybe was never there
What marvellously ridiculous rubbish, Geoffrey! Did she have small breasts, do you think, because he wrote 'hills' and not 'mountains'? 
“If you do have love it's a kind of wound, and if you don't have it it's worse.” - Leonard, July 1988
Re: love itself is gone, or maybe was never there
hydriot wrote:
>What marvellously ridiculous rubbish, Geoffrey! Did she have small breasts, do you think, because he wrote 'hills' and not 'mountains'?
I beg your pardon? mountains are rugged, hills have gentle contours - hence usage of the latter. he considered her tits as holy, not her twat - just maybe he felt threatened by it do you reckon? they say that size is not everything, but you try buying a small dildo.
>What marvellously ridiculous rubbish, Geoffrey! Did she have small breasts, do you think, because he wrote 'hills' and not 'mountains'?
I beg your pardon? mountains are rugged, hills have gentle contours - hence usage of the latter. he considered her tits as holy, not her twat - just maybe he felt threatened by it do you reckon? they say that size is not everything, but you try buying a small dildo.
Re: love itself is gone, or maybe was never there
nice phrasing 
Smaller breasts are beautiful and often keep such a lovely shape.
Perhaps you’ll bump into love while browsing the selection at that unique wine store of yours and if not you can always head upstairs and see if there’s a new whatever for yourself - nothing wrong with buying something new and showing yourself a little love.
You can tell this wine store has fascinated me as I keep bringing it up
Smaller breasts are beautiful and often keep such a lovely shape.
Perhaps you’ll bump into love while browsing the selection at that unique wine store of yours and if not you can always head upstairs and see if there’s a new whatever for yourself - nothing wrong with buying something new and showing yourself a little love.
You can tell this wine store has fascinated me as I keep bringing it up
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johnny7moons
- Posts: 121
- Joined: Mon May 26, 2003 12:59 am
Re: love itself is gone, or maybe was never there
It's always a delight to find such profound lyrical analysis going on on these pages. But in the interests of 'close reading', I must point out to the learned Geoffrey that Mr Cohen is describing the places were his lips, rather than other parts of his anatomy, have been. Perhaps he's bemoaning not his lack of endowment, but lack of skill in a certain other method of making a woman smile?
Re: love itself is gone, or maybe was never there
I dont think the 'Love' LC is takling about in this song has anything to do with what is between his or anyone else's legs
Re: love itself is gone, or maybe was never there
Cate wrote:
>Smaller breasts are beautiful and often keep such a lovely shape.
Absolutely. Perhaps it reveals a lack of greed, but I have always maintained that the best presents come in the smallest parcels, and never more so than when referring to a couple of beautifully petite bosoms wrapped delectably in the flimsiest brassiere. When walking along the pavement in town, shopping and minding my own business, nothing makes my throbbing erection disintegrate more quickly than when noticing a pair of massive melons heading straight at me.
>Now Geoffrey I have to say you’re seeming a bit restless tonight - why don’t you take a trip down to that unique wine store of yours. Perhaps you’ll bump into love while browsing the selection and if not you can always head upstairs and see if there’s a new whatever for yourself – ain’t nothin wrong with show’n yourself a little love. You can tell this wine store has fascinated me as I keep bringing it up again – was that a true story btw?
Yes, a true story. The shop's ground floor sells artifacts appertaining to wine, but in the corner is a discreet staircase. Being the Biblical scholar that I am, until I discovered that little den of sin I always associated an upstairs room with Jesus' famous 'Last Supper', but now it holds other connotations for me.
But let me now briefly address the interest shown by other posters in this thread, one which seems to have generated several inspired responses concerning Leonard's apparently salacious lyrics. For I am aware that my comments do sometimes kick open a door in peoples' brains, resulting in the pouring forth of all manner of indignation. Well, no matter. I am unarmed - and who needs weaponry when laughter can hurt more than a sword?
Listen. Leonard tends to refer to a woman's 'hills' or the 'ravine' down below rather than her eyes, ears or nose, right? I am not suggesting an unhealthy fixation with carnality, just that it would be nice if just once in a while he noticed her facial features or other virtues she may have. He said "Now you never even show it to me, do you!" - remember? If he likes looking so much at a woman's reproductive organs why didn't he train to be a gynaecologist then? That's all I'm saying.
>Smaller breasts are beautiful and often keep such a lovely shape.
Absolutely. Perhaps it reveals a lack of greed, but I have always maintained that the best presents come in the smallest parcels, and never more so than when referring to a couple of beautifully petite bosoms wrapped delectably in the flimsiest brassiere. When walking along the pavement in town, shopping and minding my own business, nothing makes my throbbing erection disintegrate more quickly than when noticing a pair of massive melons heading straight at me.
>Now Geoffrey I have to say you’re seeming a bit restless tonight - why don’t you take a trip down to that unique wine store of yours. Perhaps you’ll bump into love while browsing the selection and if not you can always head upstairs and see if there’s a new whatever for yourself – ain’t nothin wrong with show’n yourself a little love. You can tell this wine store has fascinated me as I keep bringing it up again – was that a true story btw?
Yes, a true story. The shop's ground floor sells artifacts appertaining to wine, but in the corner is a discreet staircase. Being the Biblical scholar that I am, until I discovered that little den of sin I always associated an upstairs room with Jesus' famous 'Last Supper', but now it holds other connotations for me.
But let me now briefly address the interest shown by other posters in this thread, one which seems to have generated several inspired responses concerning Leonard's apparently salacious lyrics. For I am aware that my comments do sometimes kick open a door in peoples' brains, resulting in the pouring forth of all manner of indignation. Well, no matter. I am unarmed - and who needs weaponry when laughter can hurt more than a sword?
Listen. Leonard tends to refer to a woman's 'hills' or the 'ravine' down below rather than her eyes, ears or nose, right? I am not suggesting an unhealthy fixation with carnality, just that it would be nice if just once in a while he noticed her facial features or other virtues she may have. He said "Now you never even show it to me, do you!" - remember? If he likes looking so much at a woman's reproductive organs why didn't he train to be a gynaecologist then? That's all I'm saying.
Re: love itself is gone, or maybe was never there
Geoffrey not to offend you or your penis but your throbbing erection comment is...well umm... let me think <shiver> of the technical term.. oh yes ewwwy.
now as far as well endowed woman - just a crazy thought, try looking up at her eyes.
now as far as well endowed woman - just a crazy thought, try looking up at her eyes.
Re: love itself is gone, or maybe was never there
Cate wrote:
>Geoffrey not to offend you or your . . . [snip] . . . now as far as well endowed woman - just a crazy thought, try looking up at her eyes.
Point taken, Cate, but direct eye contact can be a psychological challenge; some people who lack confidence cannot manage it at all. Have you ever tried looking into someone's eyes for more than a second? Not always easy.
However, I stand by my remarks about religious experience and love generally having little to do with the sex drive. Dogs know nothing about God or love, and neither do they need to. Nature gives all living things the urge to mate.
>Geoffrey not to offend you or your . . . [snip] . . . now as far as well endowed woman - just a crazy thought, try looking up at her eyes.
Point taken, Cate, but direct eye contact can be a psychological challenge; some people who lack confidence cannot manage it at all. Have you ever tried looking into someone's eyes for more than a second? Not always easy.
However, I stand by my remarks about religious experience and love generally having little to do with the sex drive. Dogs know nothing about God or love, and neither do they need to. Nature gives all living things the urge to mate.
Re: love itself is gone, or maybe was never there
Love and sex drive – I don’t know
I know that dogs are just domesticated wolves and wolves left to their own natural ways mate for life – meaning they sleep with their mate, share a den, raise puppies together but they’re not monogamous. – That’s not natural it’s imposed.
I don’t know if they feel love when ‘making love’ but they do seem to playfully nip and run around with each other in what seems to be an affectionate way. (don’t laugh at me but I think they’re feeling some form of love)
I know that when we have sex chemicals are released – some to make us feel good, some help us bond but I don’t know if that equals love.
I know that when my husband makes me a cup of tea, or steals my towel or touches my hair softly after a hard day that I feel more ‘mating’ urges then when I get home and see pizza boxes and dirty plates lying about.
but then I also know that there’s excitement in meeting somebody new and speculating how your bodies might move together – although what if over coffee or drinks you realized you didn’t like them, wouldn’t they seem less attractive?
-- - --
Sadly I'm not sure if I was more offended by your reference to -snip- or your reported repulsion to bustier women.
I know that dogs are just domesticated wolves and wolves left to their own natural ways mate for life – meaning they sleep with their mate, share a den, raise puppies together but they’re not monogamous. – That’s not natural it’s imposed.
I don’t know if they feel love when ‘making love’ but they do seem to playfully nip and run around with each other in what seems to be an affectionate way. (don’t laugh at me but I think they’re feeling some form of love)
I know that when we have sex chemicals are released – some to make us feel good, some help us bond but I don’t know if that equals love.
I know that when my husband makes me a cup of tea, or steals my towel or touches my hair softly after a hard day that I feel more ‘mating’ urges then when I get home and see pizza boxes and dirty plates lying about.
but then I also know that there’s excitement in meeting somebody new and speculating how your bodies might move together – although what if over coffee or drinks you realized you didn’t like them, wouldn’t they seem less attractive?
-- - --
Not always easy - yes that's true, good point. Now as far as the snip ouch.Cate wrote:
>Geoffrey not to offend you or your . . . [snip] . . . now as far as well endowed woman - just a crazy thought, try looking up at her eyes.
Point taken, Cate, but direct eye contact can be a psychological challenge; some people who lack confidence cannot manage it at all. Have you ever tried looking into someone's eyes for more than a second? Not always easy
Sadly I'm not sure if I was more offended by your reference to -snip- or your reported repulsion to bustier women.
Re: love itself is gone, or maybe was never there
Cate, have I got this right, you feel warmly disposed towards a partner who steals your towel and leaves it all wet on the bathroom floor, I cannot be reading this right surely? If that's right, then it definitely is love, I'd give him a right good kickin'
Evie B
Evie B
...he shows you where to look amid the garbage and the flowers
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John Etherington
- Posts: 2605
- Joined: Sat Sep 18, 2004 10:17 pm
Re: love itself is gone, or maybe was never there
So to summarise...quick as dogs and truly dead were we, and free as running water...
Re: love itself is gone, or maybe was never there
That's the way it's got to be, John.
Hi Evie, he just steals it. (I’ve got towel issues btw)
He sneaks in and snatches it from the hook beside the shower which leaves me stranded on the mat as the clean towels are in a cupboard just outside the bathroom - I also have not dripping on the floor issues. It’s a 20 year joke that he seems to think is still funny.
Hi Evie, he just steals it. (I’ve got towel issues btw)
He sneaks in and snatches it from the hook beside the shower which leaves me stranded on the mat as the clean towels are in a cupboard just outside the bathroom - I also have not dripping on the floor issues. It’s a 20 year joke that he seems to think is still funny.