Mythologies and Oranges.

This is for your own works!!!
Congealed Principle/Guest

Post by Congealed Principle/Guest »

Andrew,

We know the difference between "voice" in singing and "voice" in poetry.

I mean even Lizzytysh got that right! Just look back at her post where she writes to you: " 'Regarding 'people age, voices don't. Mr. Cohen found his' - so true in terms of the words that give voice. However, with the literal voice, it does age."

This lead to her daydreaming about Leonard creeping and croaking onstage.

Which in turn lead to my jovial remarks.

It's not a diatribe. It's just the way a post mutates and meanders. All over the place.

We may need therapy but we can do without an intervention.

Linda, I agree He's not that old yet. But I think he's got major problems with his voice.
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lizzytysh
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Post by lizzytysh »

Andrew,

Nor was your comment the precipitating factor for my initial posting regarding "voice" ~ in any sense of the word, except to serve as the segue for me to relate my previous thoughts regarding Leonard's. It was someone else's post that started my thinking; underscored by similar comments made by others regarding the singers I've most recently mentioned here; and then reenforced by a cd I listened to of Leonard. None of that had anything to do with anything you've said. My thought process was already complete two days prior. I just hadn't shared it here ~ until your comment on the voice gave me the segue.

Congealed Principle/Guest,

Well, how about that ~ your post regarding diatribes, mutations, meanderings, therapies, and interventions made me laugh. :lol: Hmm.....would that mean I agree? Nah....[even though I do]....there are things, with which I totally disagree, that I still find funny. Scarey thought, though.....you making me laugh. :shock:

Oh, lest we forget, "Even [I] got that right"....

All good things,
Lizzytysh
Last edited by lizzytysh on Tue Aug 06, 2002 2:44 am, edited 3 times in total.
Linda
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Post by Linda »

I don't know if you call it a problem or not. I kind of like it myself. Unless it is the cigerettes that are doing him , then he should stop that nasty little habit.
Linda
Andrew McGeever
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Mythologies and Oranges.

Post by Andrew McGeever »

Cigarettes are not a "nasty little habit" (sic). They are an addiction which people such as me find irresistible when writing, drinking, thinking, not writing, not drinking , not thinking.
I won't die from lack of ideas..just lack of breath.
Linda
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Post by Linda »

Ok, addiction, but I stand my ground on nasty, they were my constant companion for more than twenty years. They don't like being dumped and get real nasty.
Linda
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lizzytysh
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Post by lizzytysh »

After quitting 4 packs/day in 1975, I know exactly what you mean, Linda. I've never known it to be considered a "pleasant" habit, even by those indulging....that's not to say that there aren't some who consider it that. I wish that Leonard would quit, only because I know it would add years to his life, and increase the health quality of those remaining.
~Lizzytysh
Andrew McGeever
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Mythologies and Oranges.

Post by Andrew McGeever »

The lines ,"hashish and retsina danced as cigarette smoke-stanzas curled above your battered typewriter", form the core of Leonard's first "stanza" in Hydra. The "smoke" reference is an obvious key to both the man and his work ( I played "The Stranger Song" repeatedly while working on those lines: it took me ages to place the hyphen in the right place, but decided that the fitting accentuation would be to link "smoke" with "stanza", to keep the iambic flow until "battered typewriter";five syllables hit hard, as one would do on an old Olivetti .
Andrew.
George.Wright
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hash

Post by George.Wright »

There's no doubt Leonards inspired by Hash!
Georges
Andrew McGeever
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Post by Andrew McGeever »

"There's no doubt Leonards (sic) inspired by Hash!"
Your words,George, not mine. Can I inquire, though, did you intend to put an apostrophe between "d" and "s" , meaning that Leonard is inspired by Hash? Did you think before you wrote,or just wrote before you thought?
Don't answer too soon, George...take your time before you reply.You can discuss this with me "off board" if you want.
George.Wright
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To Andrew

Post by George.Wright »

see e-mail
Georges
Andrew McGeever
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Mythologies and Oranges

Post by Andrew McGeever »

To forum members,
Yes, George replied to my e-mail.
Two things can be stated in public (believe me, there was nothing else!)
1. In future, I will not comment on any offering which George posts under the "Poetry by the Forum members" section . In that respect, I've got off to a good start.
2. I neither use nor need hashish to give me "inspiration"(sic) for writing poetry.

Andrew.
P.S. For those who read poetry at face-value, can anyone tell me how many steps it really does take to climb "from the harbour to your whitewashed house on Hydra"(sic)?
P.P.S. I wish there was a section on this board where writers could criticise their work: don't get me wrong, criticism can, and should , be constructive without being adversarial. I'm not sure how many forum members understand this, but there should be no excuse for laziness in writing and reading poetry. It exercises the writer (tell me about it!) and the reader. Am I making sense ?
PoetryCop
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[b]A BUNCH OF GRANITE[/b]

Post by PoetryCop »

Dear Andrew,

Please don't use "bunch".


Very concerned,
Poetrycop
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linmag
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A Bunch of Lonesome Heroes

Post by linmag »

What's your problem with the word 'bunch', Poetrycop? If it's good enough for Leonard, surely it's good enough for any of us?
Linda

1972: Leeds, 2008: Manchester, Lyon, London O2, 2009: Wet Weybridge, 2012: Hop Farm/Wembley Arena
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Pete
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Post by Pete »

Dear Andrew,
You mention about the opportunity for others to criticise the poetry offered here. I would welcome that. I haven't studied poetry in any depth since I had to analyse the poetry of Robert Frost for my O levels in 1971.
If anyone can offer constructive advice I am sure that it would be welcomed, although I say that without consultation.
I have commented here before about the value of this shared section and how it can benefit those who do not see themselves as brilliant poets. What might come across as lazy writing to one person might actually represent hours of anguished writing in order to 'get it right'

Pete
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lizzytysh
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Post by lizzytysh »

Well, this seems as good a time as any to quote a poem by e.e. cummings that I received via "E-Verse Radio" and really liked. In light of the current discussion regarding poetry, I feel it has merit. I've always liked e.e. cummings and now I like him even more.
since feeling is first
e.e. cummings


since feeling is first
who pays any attention
to the syntax of things
will never wholly kiss you;

wholly to be a fool
while Spring is in the world

my blood approves,
and kisses are a better fate
than wisdom
lady i swear by all flowers. Don't cry
-- the best gesture of my brain is less than
your eyelids' flutter which says

we are for each other:then
laugh,leaning back in my arms
for life's not a paragraph

And death i think is no parenthesis

On the other side of the issue is that it is through constructive criticism that we learn. I've never taken a poetry class. However, if I were to place something here that I'd attempted in that vein, I would welcome specifics in terms of what works, what doesn't, why, and some possibility-type suggestions for what might work or work better.

I agree with Pete that we do not all possess the same strengths, yet we typically try to do well that which we love. That should be honoured in its own right. For something as personal as poetry, critiqueing/criticism/suggestions do well to come with a lighter touch. Until I sign up and pay for a class which one is instructing. Then, I expect to get what I paid for.....until then, the free advice~much less criticism~does better leaving harshness behind.

All good things,
Lizzytysh
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