leonardcohenforum.com

Hi,
Can anyone find a link between Jack McClelland from M&S and a certain lady named Gloria around the early 60's? I don't think she was his wife...: "Returning from overseas in July 1945, McClelland married Elizabeth Matchett late that year." (source: http://hpcanpub.mcmaster.ca/case-study/ ... mp-stewart)
I'm thinking in the lines of Gloria being employed by M&S and having to do with publishing "The Spice Box Of Earth" in 1961. Perhaps McClelland's personal assistant, secretary,... but I could be totally wrong!

Any help much appreciated!
Maarten
(going to bed now!)

If anyone could email this to Judith Fitzgerald you'd have a pretty good chance of figuring it all out through her.

lizzytysh wrote:If anyone could email this to Judith Fitzgerald you'd have a pretty good chance of figuring it all out through her.

Lizzy,
Good idea, any way to contact her?

Thanks,
Maarten
(going to bed now, almost 1am here...)

Ask Jarkko and he ought to be able to make that connection happen .
She's a tremendously knowledgeable resource, especially for stuff like this. If she doesn't know, she would sure know who would.

Hi,
Here's the reason why I was asking:
A first edition of The Spice-Box Of Earth (TSBOE) was on sale on eBay, with an inscription "To Gloria and Jack", dated May 30 1961. 1961 was the year TSBOE was published and according to Nadel's Various Positions (p98) "Reaction to the finished book was enthusiastic and admiring. To mark its publication, a launch party was held at his mother's house on May 27, 1961, with Layton and McClelland in attendance".
So the insciption is dated 3 days after the launch party to a certain "Jack". Could this have been McClelland? Possibly, no?

Here's the photo from eBay:
(eBay auction: http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?Vi ... aAryc%253D)

I believe the signature is genuine, compare it with this one from a couple of years earlier:
(source: http://hpcanpub.mcmaster.ca/media/lette ... -june-1959)

Ah, we'll never know, will we?

Maarten

Geeeeeez. It sure LOOKS the same, Maarten.
The L is crossed in the same way, with the same small loop and at the same point vertically.
The very ending of the L swoops up at the bottom on the book one and down on the letter one, but not so dramatically, either way.
The e begins at the same point vertically on the L on both.
The shape of the e is very close on both.
The o doesn't make a full close at the top on either one.
The n breaks away from the o at the same point in the same way on both.
The writing breaks after the n in both.
The first leg of the n is shorter than the second leg on both.
The a, the same as the o, doesn't fully close at the top on either one.
The r appears to be the same type that leads horizontally into the d in the same way on both.
The d fully closes on the book one and the circle part of the d is barely, if at all visible, on the letter one.
The letters that follow the L get overall smaller as they approach the d in both.
The d slants forward on the book one and slightly backward on the letter one.
Even with his full name on the letter one, there are minor differences in the formation of the letters that are shared, like how the n breaks in the middle of his first name, but swoops slightly up at the end in Cohen.
The signature on the book one appears to be written more carefully [as he might well do as he takes care in writing an inscription, whilst 'drunk' , for mailing off... the inscription sure looks like something he might have written back then].

The differences are there, but they're minor.
My attempt at 'analysis' is about the best I can do.
A professional handwriting analyst would certainly do better, but I think they're costly.

[I'm sorry it didn't work out for contact with Judith and her help.]
Were you considering bidding on it or did you already or were you just curious?
His inscription [hahah] sure seems to fit those times!

Overall, it seems to me that it's real... and, if not, it's still a 1st edition .


~ Lizzy

HA! And after all that, I remembered that it wasn't the signature you were questioning, but who Jack might be... can't you contact the seller and ask where s/he got the book from or what history s/he has on it?

Hi Lizzy,
Thanks for your very thorough analysis of the handwriting but I was indeed looking for more info re "Jack" (and Gloria) . Anyway, I don't think asking the seller will give us more info. He seems to be a large book seller, so I doubt he will have more detailed info. If he had known about a possible McClelland connection, I'm sure he'd posted it in the auction (namedropping always works on eBay). I've got a first edition just like this one here at home, so I wasn't planning on buying it but I couldn't resist placing a (humble) bet anyway (shame on me).

Thanks for the help anyway!
Take care,
Maarten

Yes, well, it was a good wake-up exercise for me on a Saturday morning, anyway... after I finished, it struck me that this isn't even what you wanted ! Never do a wake-up exercise before you've had at least ONE cup of coffee . I soon became awake enough to realize I'd gone full off on the wrong tangent ... well, keeping up with observation never hurts, right ? I had nothing planned for between 7 and 8 AM this morning, anyway.

A bet!?! A bet is what this was all about !?! Maarten! Hahahah.

I still wish you could've nailed it.


~ Lizzy

a bid... ?!

LOLOL ... gotta love those typo slips, eh? Maybe you're better off just leaving it as a bet .
You'll for sure up the ante for whoever does end up with it, though. What's it at right now?

Dear Maarten and Lizzy,

Thank you for this delightful exchange and a look at some possible Cohen paraphernalia. It's all about waking up right (7:40 on a Saturday morning). That's why I check this site. It never disappoints.
rike

Ha. You're so right, rike... it really never does. There's always something, somewhere, worthwhile. So happy that we were able to be a part of what made it so for you today . That little bit of court jester thing going on this morning, eh ?

If you return before Maarten does, let us know what the bid is at... just quite curious at this point, if you know what I mean. The only thing I've come to know about signed items is that if they're signed to a specific person, it lessens the value... unless that person is a notable [celebrity/famous/et al] themselves. So, Maarten's on target wanting to nail whether this is THE Jack [McClelland of M&S].


~ Lizzy

Lizzy,
Just a quick answer before heading of to see The Webb Sisters in Brussels (yessss)!
The auction has ended and the winning BID was 225 USD.
Check http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?Vi ... aAryc%253D

M

Ahhhh, okay. Well, when you get back from seeing The Webb Sisters in Brussels (yessss)! and can still think straight , perhaps you'll let us know if you ended up bidding on it. For what it is, the price actually doesn't seem so bad [everything's so relative and the perspective on this kind of thing has admittedly change]... and his inscription is priceless.

Enjoy !!! < I shout after you as you briskly make your way to your transport >


~ L