leonardcohenforum.com

I am chaos.
Love me or hate me
It makes no difference.
I am the world
And I do not need you.

Hi JM ~

I like the way you've chosen to express this view.

~ Lizzytysh

".....and all that jivin' around"

~Makera

That couple of lines always impressed me...

It's easy to see the self-defeating aspect of "I need you"
as a plaintive appeal, but how brilliant to identify the
false bravado of "I don't need you" as just more jivin'

Leonard sure did get inside our heads.. well it seemed
that way to me at the time.

Babz

Can anyone speak to chaos theory beyond heterogeneous
agglomoration? Georges, Ben, Pete, Kush Hmm why do
only men come to mind?

Hi Babz~

Funny ; I always thought those were the most inspired lines in that song too (not a favourite). I tended to hear them often in isolation trying to fast forward/back to the next song I wanted on my walkman: 'Last Year's Man';'Who By Fire'.

(re 'science' theories; I'm getting a distinct feeling I should introduce the word 'wanker', with its full and explicit Australian definition. Sorry, Brits, yours is too literal and simplistic.)

~Makera

Just when I thought I had *wanker* sorted out! Makera, I'm all ears.

Although Leonard has publicly apologized for 'naming' the 'nameless'
in the case of CH#2, I still think Janis came out on top.

Not ultimately, of course: 'better read than dead.'

Babz

"No one needs to be convinced how suddenly it is possible for societies, families, friendships to pass from order to chaos."

from "The Silence of God" James P. Carse,
author of "Finite and Infinite Games"

Hey Babz~

OK, *wanker*: Those pretentious, egocentric, self-deluded (and deluding) souls who believe they appear to others as they see themselves; yet have no clue how pitiable, ridiculous and/or obnoxious they are seen to be by those other than their chosen sycophants. It's a form of self-absorption that can be comical, in its irony, yet you feel embarrassed for them. They are patently superficial, incapable of real empathy, yet crave, (or expect) attention. IQ has no relation to it either; it's all about EQ (Emotional Intelligence). The ones who 'expect' attention, as their due, are the worst. Often, their greatest fear is "social death", and that's the greater irony.

I think that about covers it.

with Love,
Makera

Makera, "I think that about covers it," is what the owner of the prize stallion stud said to the owner of the recently serviced mare.

Hey Byron~

I'm... ...still... cracking up over that! You little 'punster' you!

~Makera

PS re: *wanker*: can be recognized by serious lack of genuine humour and non-comprehension of subtleties.

Cute Byron! OK Makera, I am going to commit that definition to memory, especially for my UK friends... although I can guarantee they will come back with the old saw: You Yanks don't get irony!

What about 'git' and 'sod'?

Love
Babz

Hey Babz~

Actually, if your British friends say that, I hope they don't mean to include you in that group. However, I have to agree to some extent --- I just exposed a classic case! Talk about QED!
As for 'git' and 'sod', the English definitions match. Although 'sod' is a more innocuous word in Oz. We say things like "poor sod" or "silly sod"; the Brits use it with more anger or disgust; "sod off", "sodding...(whatever)", as an adjective.

with Love

~Makera

Ciao Crone Makera,

Please do not be embarrassed! Do not feel badly about exposing your IQ.

I simply must disagree with your description of yourself. You are not a wanker. You are not "pitiable, ridiculous, or obnoxious." You have no sycophants! You are as you appear. You see yourself clearly. You see everyone clearly. Especially Edgar Cayce.

You are right about one thing. You are a classic case.

Vesuvius

P.S. Be careful! You now live among dumb Americans. You will lose your sense of irony.