Byron,
I "took" Linda after Lizzytysh said she was aligned with me.
Your remark: "Where will it end eeey, this list of yours? At the gate of the concentration camps? BECAUSE THAT'S HOW ONE LOT OF INNOCENTS ENDED UP!" was a personal attack. Not a metaphor for some hypothetical situation. Even Lizzytysh glommed onto that one with her follow-up accusation that I am in the process of "rounding-up people." So skip the disingenuous apologies.
eeey,
hell bent on war
Last edited by eeey on Fri Mar 21, 2003 6:21 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Lizzytysh,
Once again, another post where you whittle nothing off to a fine point.
First you say that George Bush masterminded the destruction of the World Trade Center, then flew down to Florida and surrounded himself with school children. And now you give us the reason. HE WANTS TO BE POPULAR!
eeey
Once again, another post where you whittle nothing off to a fine point.
First you say that George Bush masterminded the destruction of the World Trade Center, then flew down to Florida and surrounded himself with school children. And now you give us the reason. HE WANTS TO BE POPULAR!
eeey
Last edited by eeey on Fri Mar 21, 2003 6:16 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Byron
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eeey.
I am going to say this again.
I have upset you.
I apologise.
And I'm going to keep on saying it.
I apologise for upsetting you.
You are upset because of what I said and I apologise.
I apologise because of what I have written to you.
I am publicly apologising to eeey.
eeey has my full and heartfelt apology.
Apart from offering a pound of my own flesh I doubt that I can make my apology any clearer.
eeey, I apologise.
I am going to say this again.
I have upset you.
I apologise.
And I'm going to keep on saying it.
I apologise for upsetting you.
You are upset because of what I said and I apologise.
I apologise because of what I have written to you.
I am publicly apologising to eeey.
eeey has my full and heartfelt apology.
Apart from offering a pound of my own flesh I doubt that I can make my apology any clearer.
eeey, I apologise.
Quotes, quotes, and more quotes that you dig up from everywhere, I could also go to websites and cut and paste and defend my stance.
Right now I have never been more proud to be an American, I am proud of our President right now, and I say right now. I am not that brainwasher and locked in on what I believe that my opinion cannot change. I will remember what he has said during all this and hold him accountable. Next election who knows who I vote for. I will hold the world accountable in my mind also.
I totally believe in the right to protest, and free speech, but also if you are interferring with the people that are out there defending me while we are at war, I hope you get arrested.
I personally do not care on this message board whether I stand alone or not. Popularity is or never has been of any importance to me, something I have thought my children, also make up your own mind, think for yourself.
My grief with this whole thing, started with you Lizzytsh, and has gone on to others. Bringing your political views so strongly here, treating the President of your country with such disrespect as you have done while living in this country reaping the rewards goes totally against my grain.
I am ending my cyber war on this message board. I have said that before but hopefully I can keep my mouth shut now and let you Lizzytysh and your croonies wave your banners.
As intelligent as we all are in this world, that problems can not be solved any other way than death blows me away. I don't have the answer and I have not seen the answer here or on any message board as of yet. Just blame. But, I have heard a few people speak and write whom I do respect, and I am going to continue listening to them.
The world of Leonard Cohen has been interesting. Love the country but can't stand the scene. (here)
Right now I have never been more proud to be an American, I am proud of our President right now, and I say right now. I am not that brainwasher and locked in on what I believe that my opinion cannot change. I will remember what he has said during all this and hold him accountable. Next election who knows who I vote for. I will hold the world accountable in my mind also.
I totally believe in the right to protest, and free speech, but also if you are interferring with the people that are out there defending me while we are at war, I hope you get arrested.
I personally do not care on this message board whether I stand alone or not. Popularity is or never has been of any importance to me, something I have thought my children, also make up your own mind, think for yourself.
My grief with this whole thing, started with you Lizzytsh, and has gone on to others. Bringing your political views so strongly here, treating the President of your country with such disrespect as you have done while living in this country reaping the rewards goes totally against my grain.
I am ending my cyber war on this message board. I have said that before but hopefully I can keep my mouth shut now and let you Lizzytysh and your croonies wave your banners.
As intelligent as we all are in this world, that problems can not be solved any other way than death blows me away. I don't have the answer and I have not seen the answer here or on any message board as of yet. Just blame. But, I have heard a few people speak and write whom I do respect, and I am going to continue listening to them.
The world of Leonard Cohen has been interesting. Love the country but can't stand the scene. (here)
Linda
eeey, I was going to add something to that effect about the CBC but forgot in my post, I was happy to see your response. My sentiments exactly isn't it strange that these are the sources that are so highly regarded as accurate by some and all others are war mongers and what did you call Charlie Daniels Lizzyth? That question was ligitimate about his connection with LC but never mind I did my own research.
Linda
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Byron
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factitious:
For contributers to this Forum I wish to draw your attention to the following descripion of this word from The Concise Oxford Dictionary
factitious: specially contrived, not genuine, artificial, not natural
I am not on my knees.
I am not begging for forgiveness.
I am standing straight and looking eeey in the eye.
I say yet again.
I apologise.
Not contrived or having any other nuance of the word thrown in my face.
Sincerely meant.
I APOLOGISE.
To the rest of this forum I leave ALL of you to make your own minds up.
For contributers to this Forum I wish to draw your attention to the following descripion of this word from The Concise Oxford Dictionary
factitious: specially contrived, not genuine, artificial, not natural
I am not on my knees.
I am not begging for forgiveness.
I am standing straight and looking eeey in the eye.
I say yet again.
I apologise.
Not contrived or having any other nuance of the word thrown in my face.
Sincerely meant.
I APOLOGISE.
To the rest of this forum I leave ALL of you to make your own minds up.
I have also found it notable [or at least of interest], that in the midst of very serious discussions of a very grave impending and now real war, who has saw fit to bring humour into the discussion. That would be Linda, with your mothers piece, which I feel has an implicit sort of merit [given what I feel to have been, somehow ~ admittedly unsubstantiated by me, just a sense that I've gotten from the reports, though I could be wrong on that] regarding the inadequacy of the inspections. And eeey, with your assigning people into their respective groups, as a joke. Humour had not and did not cross my mind with that. Granted, with Phil Spector, I made what some considered a bad pun, on what is suspected to have been a crime committed by him.
However, the large-scale of war and potential subsequent attacks of various nature around the world, involving thousands of people worldwide, directly affecting the lives of many we know, as well as our relationships with each other [apparently], as well as generations to come and world survival as a whole, seems a rather different matter. At this point, given comments regarding France [both here and elsewhere, per the news] and given 100,000 people protesting this war in Germany alone, I'm concerned that our relationships with these two fine countries [despite the historical Hitler connection with Germany] may also end up forever altered. The Pope is also against the war, and the head [can't recall his title] of the Anglican[?] church in Britain has come out against it, as well. In addition, reportedly thousands of Christians in the U.S. are doing the same. Just doesn't seem to be a lot of humour going on right now.
However, the large-scale of war and potential subsequent attacks of various nature around the world, involving thousands of people worldwide, directly affecting the lives of many we know, as well as our relationships with each other [apparently], as well as generations to come and world survival as a whole, seems a rather different matter. At this point, given comments regarding France [both here and elsewhere, per the news] and given 100,000 people protesting this war in Germany alone, I'm concerned that our relationships with these two fine countries [despite the historical Hitler connection with Germany] may also end up forever altered. The Pope is also against the war, and the head [can't recall his title] of the Anglican[?] church in Britain has come out against it, as well. In addition, reportedly thousands of Christians in the U.S. are doing the same. Just doesn't seem to be a lot of humour going on right now.
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Sore Loser
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Incoming
(Snicker)"Leonard used to live on Hydra and go on reconnaisances to gather material for his songs."
Predictions:
Well, so far the onset of the war occurring in March, per info given to me by co-workers, with both military families and military friends, has held up.
So far, the prediction made in early February by my former husband, that the onset of the war would occur on March 21, the first day of Spring, has come within the window of the days surrounding that date. In that he's knowledgeable in both astrology and numerology, but has also followed the issues in the Mideast for many years, as well as the issues of the U.S. government, I don't know which/what played more significantly into this prediction. At the time, I didn't ask. However, he's been correct on a number of other things, based on any/all of the above, so we'll see.
Now, I'm wondering if the "originally promised" ~ which is being questioned in confusion around the world and in Iraq, after the promised 30,000 bombs ~ or tons of bombs, can't remember which measurement was used, only the immense magnitude] magnitude of this war will, instead, occur on today's date [here in the U.S., where the first day of Spring is today]. If the escalation occurs significantly, to the extent that this is touted as the official beginning, and any references [media quotable-op by Bush] are made to catch-phrases related to Spring, i.e. "a new beginning," "regrowth," "regeneration," "renewal," "a new world," "new life," or other symbolic references to this turn of season, I will consider him as being spot-on correct.....their symbolic date of choice. Right now, he couldn't be much closer without being spot-on. I'll see how it goes, and if aberration is made of this traditional season of renewal and new life, in face of such death.
In the meantime, I agree with Byron's reference to the 12 families about to be consumed with grief. I understand all that he has said about Britain's historical experience with war and bombings. I know the feeling I got last night, when for whatever reason, a helicopter kept going overhead [most likely on a search for some criminal on the run], as I imagined what it must be like to know that this airborne vehicle was here to do me harm. My heart goes out to those young, deceased men and their families, as well as to those to come. I am glad every time I hear of an Iraqi surrendering. They appear to have been ill-prepared to fight a war. Many also seem not to want to be doing so.
I remain against the government perpetrating this war, and the governments supporting this perpetration. I remain in favour of the troops sent to fight and "die" [spiritually/physically/maimed]. In the chatroom the other night, someone commented that they had no concern for those in the military who die, as they entered it by choice.
I want to emphasize, on the soldiers' behalf, that joining is not always [even rarely] done with the idea of killing in mind. Some branches/recruiters sell them a bill-of-goods of promises, and others are more truthful. However, for some, joining means an education/career/retirement that they feel they'd be unable to achieve otherwise. Others already have families and see this as a secure job with health insurance that will allow them to support that family, albeit at the poverty level. Others want to travel. Others have a family history of serving. Others feel hopeless as to what to do with their lives, so join. There are many, many reasons they join, with going abroad to kill not being one of them, I feel pretty confident in saying "for the most part." To condemn them at this point, and not be concerned with their welfare, is grossly unfair. My stance at this time is no different than it was during the VietNam or Desert Storm or any other conflicts and wars.
I pray for the welfare and safe return for the maximum number possible of both young and older men and women ~ again, everywhere.
~ Elizabeth
Well, so far the onset of the war occurring in March, per info given to me by co-workers, with both military families and military friends, has held up.
So far, the prediction made in early February by my former husband, that the onset of the war would occur on March 21, the first day of Spring, has come within the window of the days surrounding that date. In that he's knowledgeable in both astrology and numerology, but has also followed the issues in the Mideast for many years, as well as the issues of the U.S. government, I don't know which/what played more significantly into this prediction. At the time, I didn't ask. However, he's been correct on a number of other things, based on any/all of the above, so we'll see.
Now, I'm wondering if the "originally promised" ~ which is being questioned in confusion around the world and in Iraq, after the promised 30,000 bombs ~ or tons of bombs, can't remember which measurement was used, only the immense magnitude] magnitude of this war will, instead, occur on today's date [here in the U.S., where the first day of Spring is today]. If the escalation occurs significantly, to the extent that this is touted as the official beginning, and any references [media quotable-op by Bush] are made to catch-phrases related to Spring, i.e. "a new beginning," "regrowth," "regeneration," "renewal," "a new world," "new life," or other symbolic references to this turn of season, I will consider him as being spot-on correct.....their symbolic date of choice. Right now, he couldn't be much closer without being spot-on. I'll see how it goes, and if aberration is made of this traditional season of renewal and new life, in face of such death.
In the meantime, I agree with Byron's reference to the 12 families about to be consumed with grief. I understand all that he has said about Britain's historical experience with war and bombings. I know the feeling I got last night, when for whatever reason, a helicopter kept going overhead [most likely on a search for some criminal on the run], as I imagined what it must be like to know that this airborne vehicle was here to do me harm. My heart goes out to those young, deceased men and their families, as well as to those to come. I am glad every time I hear of an Iraqi surrendering. They appear to have been ill-prepared to fight a war. Many also seem not to want to be doing so.
I remain against the government perpetrating this war, and the governments supporting this perpetration. I remain in favour of the troops sent to fight and "die" [spiritually/physically/maimed]. In the chatroom the other night, someone commented that they had no concern for those in the military who die, as they entered it by choice.
I want to emphasize, on the soldiers' behalf, that joining is not always [even rarely] done with the idea of killing in mind. Some branches/recruiters sell them a bill-of-goods of promises, and others are more truthful. However, for some, joining means an education/career/retirement that they feel they'd be unable to achieve otherwise. Others already have families and see this as a secure job with health insurance that will allow them to support that family, albeit at the poverty level. Others want to travel. Others have a family history of serving. Others feel hopeless as to what to do with their lives, so join. There are many, many reasons they join, with going abroad to kill not being one of them, I feel pretty confident in saying "for the most part." To condemn them at this point, and not be concerned with their welfare, is grossly unfair. My stance at this time is no different than it was during the VietNam or Desert Storm or any other conflicts and wars.
I pray for the welfare and safe return for the maximum number possible of both young and older men and women ~ again, everywhere.
~ Elizabeth
The speculation I've been hearing on NPR, by various parties, is that the worldwide protests for peaceful resolution have impacted the U.S.'s concern for minimizing "collateral" damage and has increased their level of diligence in trying to accomplish that ~ for the sake of world perception and support of their position. Peace rallies will always serve a positive purpose.
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Byron
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Elizabeth, thank you for the posting about how much the protesters are influencing military and political decisions. It cannot be a coincidence.
On a similar but unconnected point, thousands of my countrymen took to the streets several years ago when the Government introduced the Poll Tax. It was in existence for 3 years, but by the end of that time scale, there had been so much anger and protest from every strata of society that the Tax was abolished in favour of a much fairer local tax.
Similarly, only a couple of years ago, there was a national, mass protest about the massive increase in taxes on fuel and eventually the Government capitulated, after roads, motorways etc were barracaded by ordinary people. (Not militant politicos)
Protest does carry some weight and in your example it seems that some lives will be saved.
G-d bless.
On a similar but unconnected point, thousands of my countrymen took to the streets several years ago when the Government introduced the Poll Tax. It was in existence for 3 years, but by the end of that time scale, there had been so much anger and protest from every strata of society that the Tax was abolished in favour of a much fairer local tax.
Similarly, only a couple of years ago, there was a national, mass protest about the massive increase in taxes on fuel and eventually the Government capitulated, after roads, motorways etc were barracaded by ordinary people. (Not militant politicos)
Protest does carry some weight and in your example it seems that some lives will be saved.
G-d bless.
Yes, Byron, people keeping their mouths closed regarding deeply-held beliefs will only result in a dictatorship, ex-post-facto. The most accurate word for the preceding process will not come to mind at the moment. Yes, we may not have been able to stop the war, but if we have impacted the way it is conducted, many lives will indeed be spared. Both scenarios just cited are well worth the effort.
Even though it will become impossible to do each time, as time goes on, I want to express my same heartfelt condolences regarding the American Marine lieutenant, who lost his life this morning. Oh dear, even as I am writing this, having just finished the preceding sentence, a commentator interrupted a speaker to advise of unconfirmed reports of another Marine now having lost his life. As I said, it will become impossible. My deep regrets go out for him and to his family, as well, if the reports are confirmed to be true.
Yes, G..d Bless all of His children. Remember the Sunday school pictures of children of all physical characteristics and colours standing in a circle holding hands? G..d loves us all. The Bible says to pray for your enemies. Christian or not, prayer seeks and finds the higher levels and higher purposes.
Even though it will become impossible to do each time, as time goes on, I want to express my same heartfelt condolences regarding the American Marine lieutenant, who lost his life this morning. Oh dear, even as I am writing this, having just finished the preceding sentence, a commentator interrupted a speaker to advise of unconfirmed reports of another Marine now having lost his life. As I said, it will become impossible. My deep regrets go out for him and to his family, as well, if the reports are confirmed to be true.
Yes, G..d Bless all of His children. Remember the Sunday school pictures of children of all physical characteristics and colours standing in a circle holding hands? G..d loves us all. The Bible says to pray for your enemies. Christian or not, prayer seeks and finds the higher levels and higher purposes.
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Byron
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- Joined: Tue Nov 26, 2002 3:01 pm
- Location: Mad House, Eating Tablets, Cereals, Jam, Marmalade and HONEY, with Albert
I too am saddend at this loss of life. They were only here for one life each and already they have gone from us.
My hope is that as the conflict continues we are not subjected to the usual trite, 10 second sound bites of feigned concern expressed by the young and eager to impress TV commentators, as more young men (and possibly women) meet their untimely deaths.
Did anyone hear the ITN reporter called Ian Glover-James who was reporting through CNN from Baghdad this evening as the bombs were raining down. Talk about cool, calm and collected! He could have been giving a weather report and asking about the latest cricket scores. That man deserves some mention. He made me feel very proud to be British. He didn't have a stiff upper lip, but an easy going, matter-of-fact way of reporting the events as they exploded around him.
I admired his approach to giving his listeners the facts without any of the usual histrionics we sometimes see from some self-serving reporters.
My hope is that as the conflict continues we are not subjected to the usual trite, 10 second sound bites of feigned concern expressed by the young and eager to impress TV commentators, as more young men (and possibly women) meet their untimely deaths.
Did anyone hear the ITN reporter called Ian Glover-James who was reporting through CNN from Baghdad this evening as the bombs were raining down. Talk about cool, calm and collected! He could have been giving a weather report and asking about the latest cricket scores. That man deserves some mention. He made me feel very proud to be British. He didn't have a stiff upper lip, but an easy going, matter-of-fact way of reporting the events as they exploded around him.
I admired his approach to giving his listeners the facts without any of the usual histrionics we sometimes see from some self-serving reporters.