Bruce Springsteen new albúm !

[Steven]

Hi Kush,

I like the Seger title song you linked to. Seger is a talented songwriter. Prior to
this link, I don't think I've heard more than a few songs by him in a number of years.
He does have a Springsteen-like quality in the song. At his highpoint, he was very popular.
I'm not familiar with most of his songs, so couldn't guess as to why he doesn't have
a Springsteen high profile. It didn't help him in the video to be overly dramatic
at one point (looked like posturing). The song with some modifications could
cross-over onto "southern rock" territory, and be a potential hit in that genre
(with a different artist). As is, though, it is an enjoyable song.

[Diane]

It's simple: Bruce has the highest profile cos he is the Best.

The Fire Inside is an excellent song, and nice vid. there, too.

the lines,

No matter what you dream or feel or say
It ends in dust and disarray

reminded me of Thousand Kisses poem (again). Joe Way pointed out that Diz and Ray are references to Ray Charles and Dizzie Gillespie. One more possible meaning is that diz and ray infer the word 'disarray'. In the context of the poem maybe it means, I could get a thousand kisses deep when I let things fall into disarray and stopped trying to hang on to something.

I ran with Diz I sang with Ray
I never had their sweep
but once or twice they let me play
a thousand kisses deep

Hm, Diz played jazz, which is 'music in disarray', isn't it. Interesting. It fascinates me that you like jazz, Kush. I want to know what there is to like about that "ballistic assault on scales", as you describe it. I have come to carry the question around with me like a little koan. So maybe that's why this LC point has come to my attention.

Anyway, I digress. According to the credits on my Best of Bob Seger, Roy Bittan of the E Street played piano on The Fire Inside and Roll me Away.

Someone else with a connection to Springsteen/E Street is Jim Steinman. He claims to have been inspired by Springsteen, and Max Weinberg and Roy Bittan play on the Bat Out of Hell album (Meat Loaf, writen by Steinman) and also on Dead Ringer and Steinman's own Bad for Good.

Bad For Good, Jim Steinman:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NQ85WU-Z1oQ
Can't think why anyone calls this "overblown";-)

Actually, Bob Seger has a bit of that 'overblown' sound, so the possible overacting on the video, that you noted Steven, is kinda fitting. I raise a glass to overblownness. We are Springsteen fans, after all.

[Steven]

Hi Diane,

Were but high profiles to necessarily equal quality. Just so happens that we agree on
someone who is high profile and quality. And our subjectivity has to be spot-on.
The title song video is very nice and at least one of the actresses on it is, let's say,
photogenic. Not everything ends in dust and disarray. Some things survive the dreamers,
feelers and sayers -- albeit entropy may wind down those things, eventually, at least
in conventional terms.

I enjoyed the "overblown" "Bat Out Of Hell" album, but haven't yet watched the link you posted. Didn't know about Max Weinberg and Roy Bittan being on that album. The things I learn here. "Paradise By The Dashboard Light" was a favorite of mine. Probably still is.

[Diane]

Were but high profiles to necessarily equal quality.

Touché!

And our subjectivity has to be spot-on.
The title song video is very nice and at least one of the actresses on it is, let's say,
photogenic.

The actress was sexy in that vid, but not nearly as sexy as Seger screaming "the fire inside!" Come on, you have to be objective about these things:-)

Not everything ends in dust and disarray. Some things survive the dreamers,
feelers and sayers -- albeit entropy may wind down those things, eventually, at least
in conventional terms.

The poet Carl Sandburg said, "All poets love dust and mist because all the last answers go running back to dust and mist."

Sticking with dust, Bruce said, We've got this moment now to live then it's all just dust and dark (ta K, for getting me hearing that one). And Leonard mentioned dust a few times (including in Story of Isaac - not one of my favourite songs), but his best dusty lines:

In streams of light I clearly saw
The dust you seldom see,
Out of which the nameless makes
A name for one like me.

After I have done my dusting, I may attend a local jazz festival this weekend. I have no idea what has sparked this peculiar streak of masochism.

ps I changed the Steinman track - I once loved all the overblown, galloping music on Bad for Good. Unlike other music I have liked since decades ago, Meat Loaf/Steinman has lost a lot of its appeal for me now. Yes, Paradise was a classic in its time.

[Steven]

Hi Diane,

You find Seger sexy do you? Don't know what women see in the male of the
species, unless, of course, they resemble Michangelo's "David," or maybe
someone like me. Thought the first part upon seeing a naked guy
in the gym locker room just the other day. Re: dust and mist, both make
good poetic essences, as does the possibility of spiritual/eternal charge
to all "matter" of creation. Enjoy the jazz should you go; hope it isn't
discordant stuff. Have a good weekend.

[Diane]

You find Seger sexy do you?

Not especially, not usually, and you’d have to be a girl to know that looks aren't what's most sexy. Kush and you quite possibly already know but just popping on here to mention I had an email with some info relevant just for today, if it’s of any interest. I imagine it applies only to the US, but I don’t collect these things anyway:

Columbia Records has produced a 7" vinyl single, with collectible photo insert, available only on Record Store Day, 18th April

Side A: "What Love Can Do" from Working On A Dream
Side B: "A Night With The Jersey Devil"

I agree with you re. the dust and other "matter of creation". Dust and mist seem to be pretty irreducible, speaking unscientifically. Have a good weekend yourself. Something’s cropped up and at the moment I am looking after a friend’s child so I may not be getting out at all this weekend other than to kiddies places, but no matter. Lovely sunny weather here.

[Steven]

Hi Diane,

Actually, not necessarily so, about looks and having to be a girl... some rather dull looking women, when they allow their personalilties to shine forth, can be "hotter than a pepper
sprout" (good song, that "Going To Jackson," Johnny and June Cash). But, yeah, the
male is more visually responsive, most of us, generally. Thanks for the info. on the
vinyl collectible. I'm not a collector of those kinds of things, either. Maybe others
reading this are and will be buy it, though. (About irreducibility, two weeks
ago attended a conference where a physicist used this or a similar term:
"infinite reducibility," a mindblowing concept. Should anyone have an interest,
a link can probably be posted about it.) Hope you and your friend's child have
a good weekend.

[Kush]

Hi Diane and Steven,

Yes some research tells me that Bob Seger was indeed extremely popular at one time but did not quite have such a long time at the top or close to the top as Springsteen. Well talent is only one variable of the equation and there are others that make for a successful career.
I just found out that one of my favorite Highwaymen songs (Willie, Waylon, Kris and Johnny) Against the Wind is actually a Bob Seger original.
Diane I did not know that Roy Bittan played in The Fire Inside....thats cool. I dont believe I have heard Meatloaf although I know of them. Sorry any band with a name like that makes me think too much of food to be able to concentrate on the music. But I did hear the link you provided and I dont see the similarity so much, whereas the Bob Seger sound is like the Springsteen sound in an alternative universe. And he looks and acts the part too a little. Something like Seinfeld's Bizarro world.

Diz+Ray = dissaray = jazz

Ha...that is very clever although I seriously doubt LC thought of it in that way. But it can be a good story.

Diane ....yeah going to jazz festivals is how I got exposed to the virus but in hindsight a better way is to hear a jazz quartet at a jazz club or other indoor venue. Certainly hearing live is the way to go....you can channel in the individual sounds much better (especially in the beginning) and get an appreciation of both the input and output. Listening to a CD is only hearing the output. And its usually quite inexpensive I usually spend between $10 - $ 30 depending on the venue and get to hear some really awesome bands.

I want to know what there is to like about that "ballistic assault on scales", as you describe it. I have come to carry the question around with me like a little koan.

Well I will let the master Rudresh Mahanthappa answer that question himself....the "ballistic assault on scales" was actually a compliment on his full frontal mostly aggressive style of saxophone play.

http://www.npr.org/templates/story/stor ... =101644613

the top left link on the page is a long and a very nice interview with Rudresh by Terry Gross. He goes quite in-depth about jazz, indian music, math (yeah one of his CDs Codebook was the basis of a perception experiment involving musicians and mathematicians and was reviewed in the journal Science), notes, ornamentaion of notes in Indian music, sliding and fixed hole intruments etc etc.
And if you did not manage to get to that jazz festival I'd recommend the listening to the track Convergence (also on the page) every couple of days for the next two or three weeks. Consider it a 15 minute meditation. Channel the individual sounds, track the shifts and changes and follow the overall structure. You'll catch the virus soon enough.

Last weekend I actually saw Iraqi-American trumpet player Amir Elsaffar and his Two Rivers Ensemble in which Rudresh played saxophone. Briefly chatted with them too. Very cool.

http://www.myspace.com/amirelsaffar

[Diane]

Ah, how lovely to click on here after the afternoon I've had and see your post, Kush. I look forward to listening to your links and responding later cos I have music on and also I don't want to have to think just now. This is just a pre-post post.

I normally do something pretty energetic on a Sunday but today has been different and I am totally chilled. The festival was mostly over Friday and Saturday, but I went to see a jazz trio playing for couple of hours in a seafront cafe-bar this afternoon. Just guitar, dbl bass, drums (no brass or sax unfortunately). Found it really relaxing, really nice. As I suspected, from catching jazz bands live in the past: live, jazz sounds really OK, and not the tuneless teeth-jarrer that I hear on a recording.

I had to park some distance from the venue so had a long meandering walk back along the seafront in the sunshine to get to my car. Got home a half hour ago, poured myself a niiiiice big whiskey and right now Chopin's Nocturnes and Ballades played by Vladimir Ashkenazy is playing nice n loud, and somehow captures the mood of the day for me. (Maybe an example's on youtube but I can't entertain the thought of linking to classical music on youtube just now.)

Meat Loaf is a man and not a band. I wouldn’t say he was particularly like Springsteen, other than in the tendency for orchestral rock, if that be the right term, and the fact that Max and Roy played on some of the albums. Anyhow, now that we are on Bob Seger, what next in that particular line? Tom Petty? The immensely talented Billy Joel?

Diz+Ray = dissaray = jazz

Ha...that is very clever although I seriously doubt LC thought of it in that way. But it can be a good story.

You don’t think so ? For once in my life I thought I understood a Leonard Cohen line, in words. I mean I really thought I did... Well I thought I might. Oh well:-)

OK, back later...

ps I don't understand your inference about Seger possibly being as talented as Springsteen. Seger wrote some nice lyrics, a few fine tunes, but come on, Springsteen is The Boss, forever and ever amen.

[Kush]

ps I don't understand your inference about Seger possibly being as talented as Springsteen. Seger wrote some nice lyrics, a few fine tunes, but come on, Springsteen is The Boss, forever and ever amen.

Hmm can Mike Tyson possibly be as talented as Muhammad Ali?

I just wrote what I instinctively felt thats all. more later...

[Diane]

Did I sound a bit over-indignant? I know full well that I made up the diz - ray thing, btw. Do you know if I can I set this machine to not accept posts if it detects whiskey??

Can't see me turning off my music before I fall asleep, so I'll be back tomorrow or so:-)

[Kush]

Against the Wind as I have known it all along...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ujRJtRhdlqs

Somehow it sounds more evocative than Bob Seger's original but then I was familiar with only this Highwaymen version for more than 20 years I guess.

but I went to see a jazz trio playing for couple of hours in a seafront cafe-bar this afternoon. Just guitar, dbl bass, drums (no brass or sax unfortunately). Found it really relaxing, really nice.

Sweet. I used to go to a seaside bar occasionally during summer months when I was living in NY and they would have live bands playing in the late afternoons. Fresh lobster and cold beer. And boats swaying gently. Mostly pop and rock dont remember any jazz bands.
If sax bothers you Patricia Barber's live CD 'A fortnight in France' with piano, bass, guitar and vocals is really good. She writes pretty good lyrics too. And also Habib Koite's live album Foly! has so many jazz elements, minus the sax. Atleast so to my untrained but inquisitive ears.

[Diane]

Certainly hearing live is the way to go....you can channel in the individual sounds much better (especially in the beginning) and get an appreciation of both the input and output. Listening to a CD is only hearing the output.

It's true:-) I am unlikely to become a big jazz fan overnight, but (my) everyday music is wearing a bit thin at times these days and it's nice to check out new possibilities.

Really nice interview there with Rudresh Mahanthappa. (Don't think I heard the stuff about maths but that sounds interesting, too.) It's only when two systems/cultures collide that anything truly new comes about and it seems his music is a real live example. I like the description of the music being "deeper than a watered-down version of East meets West". That's an intriguing statement.

But I will come back and listen to RM, and also Amir Elsaffar, probably on the weekend, to allow sufficient time to hear it properly, because first I wanna catch up with the other (Nusrat) thread... Indian music - very nice, but not always easy. Jazz - hmm, jury's still out, may be out for some while. Both together - Yikes! Let's keep to one at a time for a few minutes more:-)

Oops nearly missed your latest post. No, I love sax (jazz sax yet to be assessed tho'), I bought an alto sax once but found it so hard to make any decent sound come out of it I ended up giving it away, otherwise it'd just have become an ornament. Yeah, Foly is a great album. Need to give that a re-listen too - so much music, so little time...

I used to go to a seaside bar occasionally during summer months when I was living in NY and they would have live bands playing in the late afternoons. Fresh lobster and cold beer. And boats swaying gently.

Paints a nice picture. I've got memories of seaside pubs, harbourside pubs. I best not get started or my posts will get too long..

Strange to me, to hear that 'other' version of Against the Wind in your link. Hmm Bob Seger. I predict Roll Me Away will be on repeat for me by the end of the evening. Once had a big thing about that song.

ps There's something to relish, I think, about this line from Against the Wind:

Wish I didn't know now what I didn't know then.

[Diane]

I'd recommend the listening to the track Convergence (also on the page) every couple of days for the next two or three weeks. Consider it a 15 minute meditation.

Music as a spiritual discipline: we already follow that path, in all but name, n'est-ce pas? I did listen to the two tracks, Snake and Convergence on that link, and...surprisingly, I do like them!

I listened to that other longer interview, too. It's always excellent to hear someone expressing the joy they feel in indulging their creative passion. He sounds like a genuine and fascinating guy. Yeah very cool that you met him. I also really like the samples of sax by Kadri Gopalnath (solo bits). Bloody lovely that is.

What was that music perception experiment all about?

Habib Koite's live album Foly! has so many jazz elements

You have been spiking my music for some while, and my addiction to weird music has progressed dangerously since I've known you. I am only half way through your links so far. Please don't post any more. I'm not sure I can take any more .

[Diane]

Bruce said,
"You say you don't like it, girl I know you're a liar..."

I have listened to Amir ElSaffar a few times now. Some of it goes on a bit, but, really this is top stuff. The Arab feel is unmistakable. Menba is ace, and I especially enjoy the final track, the trumpet solo Maqam Awj: The trumpet (as I am used to hearing it) usually has a warm, full sound, but here it is expressing pain - it's just exquisite. The constant dark bass in the background, draws you even deeper into the piece, and balances it perfectly.

It is interesting how Rudresh Mahanthappa, as he says in his interview, and Amir ElSaffar as he says on his site, both first began their careers purely as American jazz musicians, but both then decided to embrace the music of their ancestry in a deep way, Indian and Iraqi respectively. They created this music partly as a way of resolving their personal conflicts of being "from two streams" (to use Amir's words). And that's beautiful, too.

Thanks much for bringing these artists to my attention.