"Songs of Leonard Cohen" - on vinyl

Humphrey Bear · Post by **Humphrey Bear** » Mon Oct 17, 2005 6:33 pm

lightning wrote:Humphrey Bear,
You mentioned earlier a $1000 CD player. Does one really exist? It seems to me they all sound alike, and the audiophile quality is in other components, most importantly, the speakers.

Hi Lightning,

They do indeed exist. You can get CD players that cost $20,000 or more. See this turntable?

Rolf Kelch Reference II

If picture does not show click here: http://tinyurl.com/ajmgr

Price: $30,000 (thirty thousand U.S. dollars)
And that's not even the world's most expensive turntable. There is alot of crazy expensive equipment available and some of it is unfortunately not worth the full price. When you get up into the high-end stuff you are actually paying more for the design and name.

One thing to remember when it comes to HiFi gear and price: the more you pay the less "extra" quality you get. That means the difference between a $100 CD player and a $1000 one might be very big but the difference between a $1000 CD player and a $10,000 might be impossible to detect for some. The higher up you go in price the more you are paying for smaller differences.

And yes, the speakers are the most important link in a good system.

lightning · Post by **lightning** » Tue Oct 18, 2005 1:34 am

Humphrey,
My browser could not give me picture of the $30,000 turntable. What brand its is it? What makes it so special? Wonder which music moghuls have one. Does it deign to play folk/ rock or only classical?

Humphrey Bear · Post by **Humphrey Bear** » Tue Oct 18, 2005 2:38 am

Ligtning: The problem was not your browser. The server I had uploaded the picture to had expired my link. I have updated the link and you should be able to see the picture now.

The turntable is a Rolf Kelch Reference II and is handmade in Germany. What makes it special is the mechanical construction, the quality of the material and components and also the design and size. It weighs 66 kg (145 lbs).

I do not believe it is possible to directly optimize a turntable or any other HiFi equipment for a certain type of music. Some devices have properties that make them more suitable for a specific type of music but in general a good piece of HiFi gear, wether a CD player or a speaker, should sound good with all types of music.

You can find out more about the Rolf Kelch Reference II turntable here:

http://www.theanalogdept.com/rolf_kelch ... nce_ii.htm
http://www.theanalogdept.com/rk_reference_build3.htm

lizzytysh · Post by **lizzytysh** » Tue Oct 18, 2005 5:35 am

Well, it certainly is magnificently beautiful, and unlike anything I've ever seen, or likely ever to see. I'd love to hear your brand new vinyl of Leonard's first record on it.

lightning · Post by **lightning** » Tue Oct 18, 2005 5:36 am

Awesome. It looks like it wants to play Wagner. Thanks for the picture and the information. I like the story about the owner who fished it out of the garbage when the company went broke and restored it. My kind of electronics consumer.

lizzytysh · Post by **lizzytysh** » Tue Oct 18, 2005 5:41 am

Wagner or Puccini. Both. It appears to be highly-advanced enough to enjoy what the Italians have to offer.

lightning · Post by **lightning** » Tue Oct 18, 2005 5:55 am

I find that vinyl plays best with the technology of its day. My 70's turntable (Panasonic) seems to give me less surface noise than my 90's Technics. The increase of sensitivity magnifies the problems in less than perfect vinyl.
I also find that a less than great system in a small carpeted room with the speakers placed opposite each ear sounds better than a quality system in a large cluttered loft with both speakers separated but facing forward.

Humphrey Bear · Post by **Humphrey Bear** » Tue Oct 18, 2005 7:38 am

@Lightning: Don't forget, surface noise is not related to the turntable itself. The amount of surface noise depends on your pick-up cartridge and the quality of vinyl an LP has been pressed on.

With a high-quality pick-up cartridge on a turntable playing back an LP pressed on premium-quality vinyl, surface noise will be absent or minimal.

For more info:
http://tinyurl.com/dyon4

tomsakic · Post by **tomsakic** » Tue Oct 18, 2005 10:38 am

Humphrey,
isn't the most important advantage of CD that it doesn't damage with each playing, as LP certainly does? Every single vinyl I ever saw did get scratched over the time, as much the good player was. CDs can get damaged also, yes, but they're much more persistent. What's important, they aren't scratched with playing, only if you did it manually.

Henning · Post by **Henning** » Tue Oct 18, 2005 12:36 pm

But LP and turntable are way more sexy. After almost two decades of Compact Disc I was laid by nostalgia this year and bought a new table for 400 European bucks:

http://www.kuhl-highend.de/galerie/clea ... motion.jpg

Delicious !

H.

lightning · Post by **lightning** » Tue Oct 18, 2005 4:28 pm

That's right Humphrey, it's the pick-up cartridge as well as the quality of the vinyl that determines surface noise . I've found that the cartridge on a mid-range Panasonic from 1978 works even better than that of the earlier KLH 20 I inherited from my parents which was once highly regarded.
Another thought about what's next after the Ipod. "Back to live performance," that's what some young artists are saying. They can't sell recorded music any more, it can be downloaded for free. So, instead of duplicating the concert hall experience at home we can get off our couches and show up at one.
We might even see ( as well as hear) Leonard Cohen soon.

Kush · Post by **Kush** » Tue Oct 18, 2005 6:13 pm

This turntable is amazing. Perfect symbiosis of art and engineering. Just the pic is a thing of beauty and joy to behold.
I had no idea a turntable could cost an arm and a leg.

lizzytysh · Post by **lizzytysh** » Tue Oct 18, 2005 6:52 pm

But LP and turntable are way more sexy.

That's an interesting way of expressing it, Henning ~ so true.

This turntable is amazing. Perfect symbiosis of art and engineering. Just the pic is a thing of beauty and joy to behold.
I had no idea a turntable could cost an arm and a leg.

Exactly, on everything. I was stunned when I saw it. Actually, its viewing actually hit me in my solar plexus. The precision and balance in its design; the depth of the turntable itself; the simplicity and flow of the 'signature' name; and the glow of the materials, with the bold, golden gleam of the posts in the foreground ~ WoW! A piece of art in itself ~ both in person and the photograph.

The price ~ I need a glass of water

.

~ Lizzy

lightning · Post by **lightning** » Tue Oct 18, 2005 6:52 pm

Kind of looks like an advanced alien spacecraft-- wheel within a wheel.

lizzytysh · Post by **lizzytysh** » Tue Oct 18, 2005 6:55 pm

True ~ Has contact been made in Germany? Interesting means of infiltration; presumably, because they're interested in only the most, financially advanced of our species

?