Can a prayer hold off the winter?

[Jonnie Falafel]

I'm sorry for your loss. Dogs never lie about love & we love them back. Then sadly you have to let them go. I hope fond memories sustain you. By the way, I've been moved by the stuff you've written here and thought I should let you know.

[Cate]

I'm sorry Paul, my thoughts are with you.

Cate

[Gullivor]

Thank you everyone.

One last thing...The 7 day trail sample Rimadyl the vet gave me did him in. Rimadyl works wonders but blood work should be done prior to dogs taking it not after.

Please If anyone runs into this situation yourself....INSIST on the blood work or find a safer way to help your pet.

I know Gullivor was going to pass eventually. We all are. That's reality. But he did not need to be in ICU for two days suffering and without me by his side...even though I visited twice a day...He should of been at home with his family... getting his ears rubbed.

[lizzytysh]

Oh, NO, Paul... I'm so deeply sorry to hear this!
Did the vet say that?
What was the interaction that happened with it?
That just makes this all the worse

[abby]

My condolences, Paul.

I'm the type of person who likes to own very little- just what will fit, say, into my car. Among the things I've kept for more than a decade is a tiny tin with one of my dog's tags & a tiny bit of her fur. Now there are two tiny tins, the other for my (favorite) dog who died last year. I still have her ashes above the fireplace, though I meant to scatter them months ago.

I read a novel recently by Cheryl Strayed- Torch. In it the mother dies & her family each swallow a small piece of her ashes. It seemed like such a beautiful thing to do.

[Gullivor]

Yes, Lizzy, the vet basically said that after I asked. Iv been doing research myself and read an awful lot of stuff about some dogs dying from it. But I also read a lot about how great it does work on most dogs. Gullys death was a classic example of when Rimadyl is harmful...mostly to older dogs and dogs with weak liver, pancreas, kidney and gastrointestinal problems. He didn't start showing symptoms until after his 7 day trail supply. Slowly stated eating less so I got him fresh turkey, fish and such. That worked for a while longer then he stopped and started having diarrhea. I took him to the vet and they took blood showing pancreas and kidney problems. They admitted him for Iv and monitoring, He quickly got worse. The vet said 48 hours on IV and more blood work to see if any improvement comes. By the 48 hours it was obvious he was dyeing..it was obvious to me the day before but the vet wanted to wait and see. My wife and I put him down that morning. Right where he was on his blanket exhausted.

It just a tragic thing that happened. No one is at fault. Gully was an older dog and he could of had weak kidneys and pancreas. Those things don't show any sings until they are far gone unless a blood test is given. The only thing I can do is try to turn it into something good by convincing the vet to run blood test before administering that drug...specially if the dog is an older dog. I see him Monday and will have a talk with him. Got to turn the bad into something good. Maybe this can stop a future problem so a pet and owner does not have to go through this unnecessary suffering and death.

Abby, I have always been that type of person that owns very little too. One time I started accumulating stuff in 2006 but my apartment burnt down...I got out with the underwear I was wearing and Gullivor! That's it! Some how, now, Iv managed to acquire more stuff I could ever imagine but my experience is that there is always another disaster coming down the road to set me free again.

I get Gullys ashes back in a week or two. Im gonna send some to my mom, save some for me and scatter the rest on the beach in Pompano Bch where we took many long walks to the Hillsboro inlet and back here in Sebring to an orange grove Gully and I use to get lost in. It's beautiful there. Quite and secluded. In the middle of it is a lake with a with a wooden swing chained onto and old oak tree and a picnic table overlooking the lake. We would spend hours there in prayer and meditation and thinking. At least I did. I don't know what he was thinking...he was already happy and content.

[lizzytysh]

Thanks for the rest of this information, Paul.
I'm actually surprised that the vet didn't automatically do the blood work first
But that's sad water under the bridge.

It seems you've experienced some big losses.

I'm moved by the plans you have for Gully's ashes. The scene you've described in the orange grove is idyllic.
It would be wonderful if you captured more of these memories now in short stories or poetry.

I'm so sorry, again, for your loss of Gully.

[Gullivor]

I'm actually surprised that the vet didn't automatically do the blood work first

Yes, They should of known better. They should of known.

[lizzytysh]

Yes, they should have
My hope is that you make sure to have a very careful [to avoid the ego trap] conversation with the vet about it.

[Gullivor]

It was very careful. My ego pushed far aside and in humility.

I paid my bill and asked if the Dr was in and if I could talk to him for a few minutes? They put me in an examining room to wait until he had time.

He listened, made a few scripted empathy statements and concerned facial expressions. I proposed he implement a 'policy change" to do blood work prior to rimadyl administration, especially in older dogs. He said that there is really no need for prior blood work for short term rimadyl treatment". I told him I have been doing research and he interrupted me and said that a lot on information on the internet is bad. I agreed with him and said most of it was but I got my information from the U.S. Food and Drug Administration's Center for Veterinary Medicine and pulled out copies of their reports and administration of rimadyl and recommendations, at that point he seemed to get a little irritated and didn't even try acting anymore that he was interested in anything I had to say..so I thanked him for his time and left.

I left with insight into his character and what my next steps should be (which I already started) that are including but not limited to social media reviews along with internet search reviews of his veterinary hospital. Nothing slanderous...just summing up the facts and the truth. My intentions are to inform others about the dangers of rimadyl and the importance of blood work prior to administration of rimadyl. And ,at the same time, I am getting personal satisfaction out of it all as well.

I am looking forward to picking up Gullivor's ashes as scheduled next Wednesday.

[Gullivor]

Deleted all my reviews today.

I already told the vet what I had to say and it's time for me to move away from any anger over this.

Somebody asked me once years ago and it sticks with me today... "Do you want to be right or do you want to be happy"?

[lizzytysh]

I understand your doing that, Paul; however, you might also consider it a public service and phrase it such that it's not that you're slamming him, but putting people on notice that he may not be as careful in his assessments and testing as he ought to be. They have those rating options there for a reason, and they can be very helpful in making a determination on where to go for your own health, as well as your animals' health. I recently used them to select a doctor for something and very glad that I did. In the past, I used them to select an attorney. I've used them for other things, as well.

You might want to consider SENDING him copies of what you had in your hand. Without you [and, perhaps, a feeling that there was a threat of lawsuit], maybe he'll take the time to read and learn from it and change his standard operating procedure with older dogs. The way you stated your plans below of just stating the facts and cautioning people re: getting bloodwork first, based on what the FDA sheets said, you could be making the difference in other dog's lives and, perhaps, literally.

I'm trying to figure out what I THOUGHT was my response to your visit with him. I guess I started it and then decided I didn't have time and decided to start over later and then never did .

I was shocked/stunned by his response. I would have expected more. I know so well what you mean about the scripted response. You want so much to believe they really mean and feel it. I've had one vet who I knew FULL WELL he meant it, and oh what a difference that makes.

Just thoughts... I would want to know.

[Gullivor]

The veterinarians office called me yesterday. The lady announced "Gullivor is back". She should have said his ashes have been delivered.

Your right, Lizzy!
I have rewritten my deleted reviews and wrote many more. I have also filed a report with the FDA (form 1932a) for adverse event/product problem and sent the Dr the FDA's recommendations on Rimadyl. Hopeful this can help someone else.

I ordered two cremation urn pendant necklaces for my mom and I. After filling them I will spread Gullivors remaining ashes In our out of the way places. Perhaps on the Appalachian Trail. It's been a dream of mine since childhood. Many times I have thought of Gully and I hiking it...lets see if I can get 6 months off of my regular life.

[Cate]

The lady announced "Gullivor is back". She should have said his ashes have been delivered.

oh that's bad, people can be thoughtless with their words and they forget how in grief our thinking becomes muddled and a statement like that could, just for an instant, give you a person odd hope.

I'm thinking about the reaction of your vet, who very well might have been concerned about being sued or may have been thinking about whatever it was s/he wanted to do next, or maybe he was worried that you might want to pay for a kidney problem caused by him/her ... another option is that you may have been dealing with somebody who is dealing with Compassion Fatigue which I've discovered is surprisingly common amongst vets and people who care for animals and his anxiety may have started to escalate. (I don't know of course, it's just another possibility)

Good for you for making a report to the FDA, I'm sorry for what happened to Gulliver but I hope that other families will be spared the same grief or at least have the opportunity to make a completely informed decision about next steps.

[lizzytysh]

Good G~d... I totally agree with what Cate said because when I read it, I had just an instant INSTANT flash of OMG... he survived being put to sleep [a very odd euphemism in itself] ?!? JAnd just an awful thing for someone grieving to hear.
Cognitive dissonance.
And just as Cate termed it, it was an "odd hope" in those moments.
I'm so sorry ~ don't they have protocols for this kind of thing?

Your plans sound very poignant and moving, Paul.

I'm very very glad that you re-posted your reviews and even added some. People need to know who to go to, and can generally sort through reviews, and figure out just how the good ones outweigh the bad, or the bad ones outweigh the good... and which ones seem to express valid issues.

Yes, the FDA and the vet ~ both excellent follow-throughs, as well!!!

I think Cate's right, too, regarding fear of lawsuits, etc. However, I also think that, with how you approached it, you were not threatening in that regard. It felt to me like ego. It's good that she offered some more 'positive' alternatives, even if I don't think they hold up in this particular case

I hope [and think you will] you'll come back and share your experiences of scattering Gullivor's ashes.

I, too, hope that others can be spared going through this... and with all you've done, you've maximized the chances for that.
.