Let's talk about A Life of Errands

lizzytysh · Post by **lizzytysh** » Wed Oct 22, 2003 8:20 pm

"How Thirstily
You Embrace Your Next Commission:
To Sift Through The Sunglasses
At A Lost And Found
In Las Vegas
Just A Few Hours
Across The Desert."

[OK, I'm going next. Joe's been here and gone twice, for sure, that I've seen, and............so...........continuing.........]

"How anxious you are/will be to, readily and happily, follow through on the next errand you were asked, given permission, and agreed to do. To do it, it will take 'just' a few hours to drive to Las Vegas, the route requiring that you cross the desert in order to get there. Once there, you will willingly sort through what you already know will be a lot of sunglasses that other people have also left behind, and that have ended up in the official 'Lost and Found.' This is a task that, for whatever reason, you are very happy to do, regardless of the terrain, the time, and the thirst that one could [conceivably] incur by driving across the desert." [I have my own ideas as to the "why" of it

.]

[I really like that before he's even left, he is metaphorically consistent, "thirstily" embracing the task/the errand, before he even gets to the desert.]

Even though the "Lost and Found" is an official term for any location designated for compiling items left behind in public places, I like the lost/found aspects of it in the context of the entire poem.

OK, I did my part. Helven? Tchocolatl? Vesuviua? Joe? I know someone has to have something to add to this

.

~ Lizzy

Joe Way · Post by **Joe Way** » Wed Oct 22, 2003 8:57 pm

I find the lines, "You Have Breasts/And A Gut" to be strikingly similar to the lines from Eliot's The Waste Land, "I, Tiresias, though blind, throbbing between two lives/Old Man with wrinkled female breasts."

Tiresias is a soothsayer, son of Everes, the shepard and Chariclo, the nymph. Various stories are told about how he is blinded. In one, he is blinded by Athena because he has seen her naked. However to compensate, she gives him the gift of prohesy and long life, and the ability to translate birdsong.

In another story, it is said that he came upon two snakes copulating and struck the female snake and became a woman for seven years afterwhich he came upon two other snakes copulating and struck the male and became a man again. Zeus and Hera are having an argument over who enjoys sex more-the man or the woman-and comes to him since he has experience as both. He says, "Of ten parts a man enjoys only one, but a woman enjoys the full ten parts in her heart." Hera blinded him and Zeus gave him the power to utter oracles. He is heard right before he dies to say this: "What is a seer? A man with luck tells the truth sometimes with frequent falsehood, but when his luck deserts him, collapses then and there. (Archilles, Euridides, Iphigenia in Aulis, 955)

I also find it interesting that Leonard's other poem referencing New Year's Eve, "The Music Crept By Us" mentioned by Lightning, is also a line in The Waste Land. (The line appears originally in Shakespeare's The Tempest.

Joe

lizzytysh · Post by **lizzytysh** » Wed Oct 22, 2003 9:24 pm

This is where/how [all of] you, who are broadly read, bring so much texture, colour, and meaning to Leonard's lines.......whereas, some of us [that would be me

] wing it, with the more "everyday" interpretation of his words. He, of course, seems [given his past history

] to draw from many, many areas, to give us multiple layers. This is really great information, Joe

! Lines that would ring bells with you ~ and go virtually or literally unnoticed [in the literary sense] by me. As we tend to quote and paraphrase Leonard, and those we admire, I'm not surprized that parallels to the lines of [great] other writers would appear in Leonard's writing. Thanks for sharing all that!

Tying it in, would your reading be along the lines of, "If you are lucky, you will be as Tiresias"? or "........, you will see life from 'both sides now'"? If I haven't "hit" on it, could you draw it in for me? Thanks! It's intrigueing that, even so long ago, the male's enjoyment of sex is portrayed very similar to what it would be today. Must be something to that!

~ Lizzy

Joe Way · Post by **Joe Way** » Wed Oct 22, 2003 11:08 pm

Hi Lizzy,

I don't think that it is necessary to have "literary" information to enjoy the poem, but I think that it adds a certain richness to it that only deepens the pleasure. As you and many others have pointed out-the poem uses simple words and word structures to reach a fairly straightforward conclusion that a certain cheerfulness and gratitude has graced the poet's later years.

Several years ago, the National Lampoon ran an article capsulizing famous poems in brief snippets. For example, Keats' Ode to a Nightengale was described as "A poet sees a bird and thinks of death." This was also the description for Poe's The Raven. Most of the poems could be capsulized as "The poet sees (an object) and thinks of sex and then of death."

How would we capsulize this poem?

I don't think I've worked out all of the richness found within this poem yet. There are probably levels that Leonard himself is still discovering, put there with unconscious serendipity.

By the way, I looked at a map and the 405 is one of the freeways going through a part of LA, but it doesn't run all the way down to San Diego.

One other comment, when I think of acorns and animals, the image of the squirrel comes to mind, long before the pig. Don't squirrels hoard acorns for the winter?

Joe

Byron · Post by **Byron** » Wed Oct 22, 2003 11:50 pm

squirrels are well known for the condition of their nuts

Helven · Post by **Helven** » Wed Oct 22, 2003 11:51 pm

Hi Elizabeth,
Thank you for doing that! The meaning of that phrase wasn’t clear for me. And now it’s much easer to understand what the “Yes, Sir” sentence is about [Tchocolatl, this one was quite nebulous for me, as well].

Hi Joe,
The parallels you’ve drawn are very interesting. I inclined to consider those words to be about the mere fact that someone became “not so well-built”. But there is something to think over here! Thanks!

And now….since we haven’t any restatement of this sentence

……I’ll do it!

(And the next one I hope will be restated by someone else!

)

Your Hair Is White
You Have Breasts
And A Gut
Over Your Belt
You Are No Longer A Boy,
Or Even A Man
But A Sense Of Gratitude
Enlivens Every Move You Make.

You’re white -haired, you have breasts and a pot-belly; you are too old to considered to be even a man – but not only a boy; but the sense of gratitude is visible in every your move, “lives” in every your move, “fills every your move with life”.

TH

PS I don’t know if squirrels hoard acorns. But it’s interesting – what does a squirrel symbolize in various cultures?

Helven · Post by **Helven** » Thu Oct 23, 2003 12:02 am

Dear Byron,

I’d like to thank you again for the link you’ve put here. Running through that site I found a link to the Shakespeare site. And now……now I’m there.

I’ve never read Shakespeare in English!

TH

lizzytysh · Post by **lizzytysh** » Thu Oct 23, 2003 12:03 am

Hi Joe ~

I agree that the literary background information isn't necessary for the enjoyment of the poem. The distinction that I had in mind, is that it most definitely adds to the enjoyment with the texture, the richness, the layerings, etc. [as you've also noted]. "Knowing" the extent of Leonard's self-education/formal education ~ and his many references to things other than the mere words used [won't spell out the list that I've done many times before], it's not at all unreasonable to think [and look for] that there would be connections within the simplest of lines. One example is what you've brought out here, with Tiresias.

Very interesting about the 405. Not sure what to make of that just yet, unless the highway was, before or since, rerouted!?! Or that was the primary road, for the onset of the trip, and the poetic license comes in not feeling compelled to list all the tributaries and turns one makes or uses?

Cute how the National Lampoon did their article.....rather true, as well. Of course, the sex-before-death thoughts......well, who could argue with that

?

Absolutely, on the squirrels gathering acorns for the winter. Perhaps "Leonard" was running down to pick up some winter supplies for someone, i.e. something that was to be used for some hard/difficult times to come. We got into the pig conversation in the lovely, rambling nature of threads and discussions, with one use of acorns mythologically being for pigs' food.

I'm not going to try to capsulize this poem yet. Waiting on Professor Sohbet to see if that's part of the end game, if not the grand checkmate

. It looks like you're holding back a little on going there just yet, too. Still willing to discover some more of the hidden richness.

~ Lizzy

lizzytysh · Post by **lizzytysh** » Thu Oct 23, 2003 12:12 am

Hi Helven ~

You're welcome

!

Without much time to study your restatement

, the only thing I'd like to insert for consideration later is with regard to "But A Sense Of Gratitude / Enlivens Every Move You Make." Being an "old" person who is not infirm, unable to get around, unable to move; who has the connections with other people [i.e. is not living an isolated life, as a shut-in]; and who is independent in his mobility, and his transportation ~ all of these leave soooo much to be grateful for. "Every Move" ~ literally ~ is something to be grateful for; and gratitude for what you have, indeed, enlivens you, often including your [every] step. You can even [often] see it in a person's walk. I think I'm probably sticking my toes into interpretation with this, though; maybe even both feet

.

I need to leave soon, so I'll talk with you more later. I agree that the gut and breasts, I saw as being symbolic of the body's breakdown that occurs through aging.

Reading Shakespeare in English for the first time ~ that is very cool, Helven

. Have you been reading him in Russian prior to this? Or in other languages, as well? It will be interesting for you to compare.

~ Lizzy

Byron · Post by **Byron** » Thu Oct 23, 2003 12:48 am

Helven, most English people have not read Shakespeare in English either.

However, if you want to discover truth and enlightenment, strung together on beads of wisdom (I just thought of that one folks) you will find everything laid before you by him. Start with Hamlet because it has an international theme to it, and it concentrates on one man's madness as his family and friends play games with one another. Also, there is much humour and irony. Shakespeare was writing for a crowd of London theatre fans, and he loved to play them along, with his actors standing almost in the middle of the audience. He was writing for a few people who could read and write and had power, as well as the majority who were illiterate. He had to appeal to all levels of society and that is why his work is so multilayered. It is pure joy to sit and read him. He could have been writing about the issues of today. He is universal. I hope you can find time to enjoy him.
Byron 'sends his regards.'

Helven · Post by **Helven** » Thu Oct 23, 2003 4:32 am

I told my friends about this exercise and as soon as I mentioned some “unusual” way to interpret an acorn symbol they immediately exclaimed - “Ah! Pigs!”

So here this acorns-pigs connection is one of the first things that come into the head. And it’s quite easy to explain. When we were little children our parents (and then primary school teachers) acquainted all of us with the same set of pieces of classic literature. We heard them, read them, learnt by heart… And one of the items from that set was the Krylov’s fable “The Pig under the Oak” [Krylov was Russian writer of fables in verse (18th-19th c) who interpreted Aesop’s and La Fontaine’s fables and wrote his own ones; and the above-mentioned fable was about a pig that having acorns eaten became to dig ground around the oak roots saying “May this oak die! It’s no use!” – and in the end this pig was compared with an ignorant person who didn’t appreciate science/arts and education while “eating” their fruits.]

I tried to find an English translation of that fable but, instead of it, have found something else. Get some fun!
http://danr.ucop.edu/ihrmp/oak103.htm

***************
Dear Byron, I read different translations of Hamlet (Pasternak’s one and one more - but I don’t remember who did it). And I still think it will be too hard for me to read this item in English! But, of course, I’ll follow your advice.
By the way, there was one remarkable production of Hamlet here. Vysotsky (I think you heard about him) played Hamlet. There were no splendid costumes and set – but the “nerve” and the energy of actor’s playing only. And it was stunning - shivers were running down the spine. I saw only some fragments that were demonstrated on the TV (I was a little girl when Vysotsky died so didn’t see him

) but they were enough to appreciate it!
The only thing I’m not able to understand – what language English people use to read Shakespeare…
HT

Joe Way · Post by **Joe Way** » Thu Oct 23, 2003 8:57 am

Hi Helven,
I think that the references to the porcine adds much to our little discussion-so I wasn't trying to diminish this by introducing the squirrel!

I, of course, don't know for sure if Leo was referencing Tiresias in the poem. Poets are much too subtle to leave their fingerprints all over the place where they can be traced. But the addition of the "breasts" seems quite deliberate and although the character, Kramer, on Seinfeld helps invent the "mansierre" to help deal with this problem for aging men, it seems that LC went out of his way to bring this in.

I have to mention as well that I am a huge Shakespeare fan-we have a theatre company nearby who produces between two and three Shakespearean productions a year (as well as Shaw, Chekhov, Ibsen, Wilde and many others). I note that Leonard does not place himself in this category. He mentions in an interview that he hopes he will be remembered as a minor poet and gives us the name Humbert Wolfe, a poet, whose book he found in a used bookstore and enjoyed. I think he secretly delights in being discovered in similar ways.

The major poets-Eliot says-"Dante and Shakespear divide the universe; there is no third"-use great themes in their work, and there is at times a pomposity that Leonard is careful to avoid. I say this while mentioning both Dante and Shakespeare whose work was quite carefully crafted to appeal to the masses. (I will never forget seeing a production of Titus Andronicus-a play that is seldom produced these days, but was one of the "hits" of Shakespeare's time. The company produced it in the way that they felt Shakespeare did for the Elizabethean's. This meant that the putting out of the eyes of a character, the beheading, and several other gory scenes needed to be rendered "realistically" as the Elizabethean's would have demanded. We were seated directly between a group of high school students dragged to the occasion by their instructors and a group of senior citizens on a tour, out to get their culture. As the play wore on, the high school students were getting more and more into it, while several of the elderly ladies said, "Oh my, this is rather gory, isn't it!" So one will never know exactly what appeals and to whom-the nature of the audience remains a mystery.

I'm off to bed now, but I hope to discuss some of the "musical" aspects of the poem soon or at least my thoughts on what would occur to setting this to music.

Good night all.

Joe

P. S. Byron, I would hope that we are all careful of our nuts.

Makera · Post by **Makera** » Thu Oct 23, 2003 1:14 pm

Joe Way:There are probably levels that Leonard himself is still discovering, put there with unconscious serendipity

Hi Joe~

This is so true! Sometimes when the words flow into a work, the unconscious influences in ways meant for future reference: a sign post, a new 'layer' or angle for the author. Also, in the 'collective unconscious' scheme of things, the choice of words can be meant for one(s) other than the author's first conscious thought or intention. Ah, "What a piece of work is a man, how noble in reason, how infinite in faculties;...." (Hamlet)

I was most interested in your references to the Tiresias myth (one I was not familiar with), particularly the last words: "What is a Seer? A man of luck tells the truth sometimes with frequent falsehood..." This is what struck me in "A Life Of Errands". The ambiguity, or sheer irony, of the opening line "If You Are Lucky", to the transparent 'falsehood' in the last. (Hence my mention earlier of "protest too much".) [The clue: when someone loses/misplaces an object, they cannot recall exactly where they lost it, or even the specific whereabouts in a place they have been.] The obsequious "Yes Sir..No Sir" would gain the 'Luck', i.e. the psychological 'free pass'(pity), for it to work. He takes a punt, gambles on achieving his 'mission'.

Yes, the works of Shakespeare are uncanny in the depths of wisdom they contain, "Full fathom five.."

Helven-Tanya~
I believe Byron meant that most English people haven't read Shakespeare at all in their own language, never mind any other! The Elizabethan English is a bit too heavy going for many. They don't know what they're missing, do they Byron?

~Makera

Helven · Post by **Helven** » Thu Oct 23, 2003 4:13 pm

Joe, of course, I didn’t mean your references diminished mine! I just recalled my talk with friends and it seemed to me funny enough to mention it here - I hoped it would be funny for others, as well.

Makera/Gennelle, yes, I understood what Byron told about. It was only my poor joke

on English language.

TH

lizzytysh · Post by **lizzytysh** » Thu Oct 23, 2003 6:46 pm

Makera ~

The contrast of the first and last lines, as you've pointed out, does have potential

. That "Twilight Zone" ["another" poem going on, in a concurrent, alternate reality, on "the other side of the wall"] perspective, in contrast to the overall jist and perspective that we're giving it. It sure wouldn't be unlike Leonard to do it with that ironic twist.

~ Elizabeth