untitled

[lazariuk]

you take me to your basement
saying I'm not your cup of tea
then you show your flower arrangement
saying it looks strangely like me

to tell you that you're nose is too big
I had driven back clear across town
then you kiss me right on the lips
just for having turned around

I don't know why you bother with me
I know I'm wrong in so many ways
then you grab and guide my hand
saying be wrong for days and days and days

[Lion of Lions]

you take me to your basement
saying I'm not your cup of tea
then you show your flower arrangement
saying it looks strangely like me

to tell you that you're nose is too big
I had driven back clear across town
then you kiss me right on the lips
just for having turned around

I don't know why you bother with me
I know I'm wrong in so many ways
then you grab and guide my hand
saying be wrong for days and days and days

Some thoughts about your poem, which you call "untitled". This indicates to me a lack of imagination or a rush to post (a very bad idea!). It could even indicate a certain pretentiousness ("I'm too important to think of a title").

I acknowledge that English is presumably not your first language, so well done for trying! The biggest problem you have to overcome is the lack of rhythm throughout the poem. Did you read it back before posting?



you take me to your basement
saying I'm not your cup of tea - this second line is half a syllable too crowded and can only flow by swallowing the first word, "saying"
then you show your flower arrangement "you" and "your" doesn't work, it reads empty and should be "you show me your", by adding "me" it not only flows better but continues the relationship, otherwise it sounds like your boyfriend is simply exhibiting his flower arrangement to the public
saying it looks strangely like me this is an airy line, the sounds aren't grounded


to tell you that you're nose is too big
blunder on the apostrophe and it needs to be a very good poem to earn the right to start with the infinitive, it certainly doesn't work here
I had driven back clear across town this is a clumsy line with "clear" in particular not working. find a different word for the dull "driven", did you "race" perhaps?
then you kiss me right on the lips "right" is similar to your use of the word "clear", unimaginative filler words
just for having turned around clunky line

I don't know why you bother with me clunky
I know I'm wrong in so many ways clunky, if this poem is salvageable at all then "why bother with me, wrong in so many ways" would at least not have the same dead clunkiness
then you grab and guide my hand "grab" is ok but "guide" is certainly not. perhaps you thought it was automatically poetic to use words starting with the same letter? to where was your hand being guided? is it on a tourist trip?
saying be wrong for days and days and days this line is wrong for clunky and clunky and clunky, and is a weak ending


I think you have a good idea, the story is fun, but I wonder if you rushed the entire piece? It might be that you simply lack a sense of rhythm in your writing and that is not easy to give to someone, particularly if writing in a second language, but repeated reading and revision would help.

[lizzytysh]

My favourite two lines in this poem are:

then you kiss me right on the lips
just for having turned around

[Was the use of "right" the set-up for the "wrong" that follows in the next verse?]
Taking into account LoL's rhythm concerns, I guess that would become:

then you kiss me on the lips
for having turned around

[or]
just for having turned around


Don't have time to sort that right now. I also like the idea of the poem.

I agree that the rhythm situation can use improvement.


~ Lizzy

[Lion of Lions]

I've been thinking more about the original, particularly the line

"to tell you that you're nose is too big"

and I realise now that what the writer may have meant. perhaps he thinks his boyfriend is a nose. but to tell him that he is a nose would be too big a step in their relationship. but it does conjure up a good image of a relationship in turmoil.

Man 1 - "you look like a flower arrangement!"

Man 2 " "you are a nose!"

Man 2 then grabs and guides Man 1's hand all over his body to confirm or refute that Man 2 is a nose?

Man 1 then says "you are the scenter of my universe"

[lazariuk]

I acknowledge that English is presumably not your first language, so well done for trying! The biggest problem you have to overcome is the lack of rhythm throughout the poem. Did you read it back before posting?

You presumed correctly and I would like you to consider the implications. I was born in Montreal and I live in Montreal but I only speak english. I think I speak english well but it is my second language. I see now the problem I had was also with the people who were trying to teach me. I learned a little bit about how I don't like being taught.

I greatly appreciate the effort you have put into helping me with this poetry business but want you to know that should you stick around how difficult the task might be, but even if you have no intention of sticking around I might as well say it for others who may. I like people helping me learn as long as they don't mind me telling them what is not helping.

This idea of second languages is interesting. I think I can easily write a decent story but I don't think I can easily write a decent poem. Sometimes people say that I write good poems but that is like people telling me that I speak good french. There are some things in french that I say very well like "Would you like something to drink?" or "Would you like something to drink?" I say it very well because it is my first language but when people say that I speak good french it sounds more to me like they are just speaking poor english and really meant that I give good french.

It all very complicated Lion but to help make it less so let me tell you what makes it hard to learn from you. All the things that you tell me about how the words sound to you is very helpful but then you have to go and throw in things that are so unnecessary and cause problems like for example saying that the poem is to my boyfriend. By doing that it makes me feel that by following your advice that it may lead in a direction that I have no interest in going with the poem and then that makes me want to explain myself and doing so can cause even more problems. I will try to show you how by explaining the poem to you.

my dog has her spot in the basement and one day she led me there by not wanting me to go there, she had a guilty look on her face when I moved toward the basement and so her look was saying that I am not her cup of tea, she doesn't want me to be going there but that is what is taking me there. When we get there I see what she didn't want me to see. She didn't want me to see that she had knocked over a bag of flour and had spread it out over the floor and feeling guilty she then went right into the middle of the arrangement and pissed a bit out of nervousness and being someone that gets pissed on because of other people's nervousness she was showing that the flour arrangement looked like me. I thought it would be funny to spell flour wrong.
but the problem with explaining is that I have a girlfriend who has seen me in a flower arrangement and now I become worried that if she sees this explanation and she doesn't even know that I have a dog she might be thinking that I am seeing her as a bitch. So then I will need to explain all the way to the end and tell of how one day before leaving for a meeting and being half awake I had barely noticed that when petting my dog before leaving she had turned her nose away from a certain part of my body but as I was clear across town the dogs message finally reached me and I had to drive all the way back to change my shirt. I thought that it was probably better that I didn't know what her nose told me and so when I arrived I yelled at her that her nose was too big but she was just glad to see me so soon and even as I was yelling kissed me right on the lips, the very lips that were scolding her.
One of the things that I like about her is that she is not shy to come and grab my hand as dogs sometimes do and guide it to where she wants to be rubbed and so that is why I used both grab and guide.
But now that I have explained the whole poem so as not to have a girl friend offended I realize that I have a boy friend that might be offended that maybe I have never gone to such lengths for him.
So do you the see the mess that gets created?
So if you take out the stuff that you don't know anything about and just leave what you do know something about you would make it much easier on me.
Also what use is it to make comments about my character when you see that I have not titled the poem yet? You have no way of knowing why so why not just leave it at that. Did you come here to help me with the poem or to say what you think of me as a person?
You do say that you think there is a fun story so why not say more about why you think there is a fun story. Say a little bit about yourself. What is fun for you? What did you find to be fun in my words? I like fun and if you can show me a direction that seems more fun than the direction I was headed, I'm easy, I'll change directions.
The fact is the poem is not titled because I don't have a clue what it is finally about. It certainly isn't a poem about a dog.

[lazariuk]

I think you have a good idea, the story is fun, but I wonder if you rushed the entire piece? It might be that you simply lack a sense of rhythm in your writing and that is not easy to give to someone, particularly if writing in a second language, but repeated reading and revision would help.

Would you tell someone learning a second language to not say anything in public until they knew that they were saying it exactly as it should be said?

[lazariuk]

I take you to the attic
before even a cup of tea
show a flower arrangement
looking strangely like me

by saying what could be hot
A dinner was made too cold
by motioning to advance
I made the troops less bold

maybe thats why you bother
cause I'm wrong in so many ways
that you can grab and guide my hand
to be wrong for days and days and days

[Lion of Lions]

thanks for the explanation, it makes the poem more trivial that I realised and yet less bad as well.

In memory of your pet, I offer these lines of consolation

Everybody nose that your lines are leaking
Everybody nose that your rhythm died
All your rhymes have a broken feeling
I'm sad that you dog just died

Have you translated the piece into French? I would love to read about your "chaud chien".

[Lion of Lions]

I think you have a good idea, the story is fun, but I wonder if you rushed the entire piece? It might be that you simply lack a sense of rhythm in your writing and that is not easy to give to someone, particularly if writing in a second language, but repeated reading and revision would help.

Would you tell someone learning a second language to not say anything in public until they knew that they were saying it exactly as it should be said?

hey, I wouldn't even tell them that the form is "not to say anything" rather than your "to not say anything".

[lazariuk]

I think you have a good idea, the story is fun, but I wonder if you rushed the entire piece? It might be that you simply lack a sense of rhythm in your writing and that is not easy to give to someone, particularly if writing in a second language, but repeated reading and revision would help.

Would you tell someone learning a second language to not say anything in public until they knew that they were saying it exactly as it should be said?

hey, I wouldn't even tell them that the form is "not to say anything" rather than your "to not say anything".

Of course you wouldn't because you wouldn't know that they would say "to not say anything" until they said it.

A way to answer the direct question I asked is that you could have said

"No, I would encourage them to try and then when they did I would point out that their wording didn't sound quite right and see if they could find the mistake they made"

just in case you are in any way still interested in helping me learn I want you to know that the best teacher I ever had was the one who encouraged me to make a lot of mistakes and found ways to help me find them myself.

The worse were the ones who only had fun showing what had been done to them.

[lazariuk]

just in case you are in any way still interested in helping me learn I want you to know that the best teacher I ever had was the one who encouraged me to make a lot of mistakes and found ways to help me find them myself.

The worse were the ones who only had fun showing what had been done to them.

I think I made a mistake there. It would be more accurate to say "more to my liking" than best and worse.

[lazariuk]

My favourite two lines in this poem are:

then you kiss me right on the lips
just for having turned around

[Was the use of "right" the set-up for the "wrong" that follows in the next verse?]
Taking into account LoL's rhythm concerns, I guess that would become:

I agree with you Lizzy in favoring those two lines. I had in mind something else I once wrote: "a kiss can move all over the place but it still remains a kiss" combined with the idea that how direct the kiss will be depends on the completeness of the turning. Sometimes by luck the turning is a decent one and you get rewarded for this luck with a very decent kiss.

[Geoffrey]

Jack wrote:
>I had in mind something else I once wrote: "a kiss can move all over the place but it still remains a kiss" combined with the idea that how direct the kiss will be depends on the completeness of the turning. Sometimes by luck the turning is a decent one and you get rewarded for this luck with a very decent kiss.

you might be embraced
by the assassin
you might think
that you're in bliss -
but don't forget
that there are teeth
in every judas kiss