What's wrong with being a fan?

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TipperaryAnn
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What's wrong with being a fan?

Postby TipperaryAnn » Tue Oct 02, 2012 9:04 pm

Just a thought - who are more beneficial to LC, those "scholars" who add to the piles of stuff already written about him, or those "fans" who buy his cd s and expensive concert tickets?

This thought arises from recent anti-fan remarks on the forum, especially a virulent attack on "new" fans on the Verona thread - that term seems to cover everyone who joined this forum since 2008!

Somehow I think that in years to come when live tours have ended, there will be tomes of dissertations etc. about him lying abandoned on dusty shelves, but there will still be fans, old and new, listening to and delighting in Leonard's songs - they are his claim to immortality.

"You'll be hearing from me baby, long after I'm gone.
I'll be speaking to you sweetly from a window in the Tower of Song."
Forget your perfect offering -
There is a crack in everything...
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Goldin
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Re: What's wrong with being a fan?

Postby Goldin » Tue Oct 02, 2012 9:57 pm

Both of them are great.

So I'm closing this thread for myself, although I'm afraid there will be some disputes here and I'm sure some good and wice phrases will be written as well.
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John Etherington
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Re: What's wrong with being a fan?

Postby John Etherington » Wed Oct 03, 2012 1:28 pm

What's wrong with being a fan? I would say - the mentality that goes with identifying with the word "fan"! :D
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LisaLCFan
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Re: What's wrong with being a fan?

Postby LisaLCFan » Wed Oct 03, 2012 9:53 pm

First, I have no problem with calling oneself a "fan" (which may be obvious from my forum name!). I would think that the word has different meanings to different people, different degrees of enthusiasm may be involved, etc. I think that it is unfair and inaccurate to assume that all self-proclaimed "fans" share a single mentality. I dislike generalizing about people. It is a very lazy way to think about others, although, I do it sometimes, too, because it is so easy. But, I think it disregards the complexity of each individual and the many different reasons that motivate each of us to do and be who we are.

As for the "piles of stuff" written by "scholars" (whatever that means: are you talking about everything that is written/published about Leonard, or actual "scholarly literature" in the academic sense?), I have no problem with that, either (whatever form it takes). Some "fans" may really enjoy reading it, while others could not care less. Also, some of the "scholars" may also be "fans." In addition, genuine scholarly literature about Leonard (written by academics) seems to indicate that Leonard's work is taken very seriously, and that he is a respected writer, and that will surely contribute to the longevity of his work (if nobody had ever bothered to talk/write about Shakespeare, would he still be famous?).

I see no harm in any of these things. "Attacking" innocent people for who they are and what they do, on the other hand, is harmful, and there is no need for it.
Cate
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Re: What's wrong with being a fan?

Postby Cate » Wed Oct 03, 2012 11:06 pm

Goldin wrote:Both of them are great.

So I'm closing this thread for myself, although I'm afraid there will be some disputes here and I'm sure some good and wice phrases will be written as well.
I agree, both are great. We have such an amazing mixture of people here. Some bring new ways to see something, opening up a simple lyric to wonderful possibilities, others bring an exuberance that fuels the excitement. A fan, a philosopher, an admirer, a mystic, a cohenite or a beautiful loser ... it's all good and it's all the better for being our different selves together.
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TipperaryAnn
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Re: What's wrong with being a fan?

Postby TipperaryAnn » Fri Oct 05, 2012 4:30 pm

LisaLCFan wrote:First, I have no problem with calling oneself a "fan" (which may be obvious from my forum name!). I would think that the word has different meanings to different people, different degrees of enthusiasm may be involved, etc. I think that it is unfair and inaccurate to assume that all self-proclaimed "fans" share a single mentality. I dislike generalizing about people. It is a very lazy way to think about others.
Well said, Lisa. It's just a handy 3 letter word that covers WE-WHO-ENJOY-LEONARD-COHEN'S-MUSIC in our varied ways. (Should we start using WWELCM now, John, instead? ( Actually, John, I'm glad to see you're still there - many of the people whose posts I used to enjoy reading have drifted away from the forum... I wonder why...)

You ask, Lisa, whether Shakespeare would be famous if nobody had talked about him or written about him - the answer is YES! We know almost nothing about Shakespeare the man, ( except a few yarns about to whom he left his second best bed! ) but his "FANS" kept him alive - enough people loved his poems and his plays to pass them on to the next generation. He recognised this himself in sonnet 18:

"So long as men can breathe and eyes can see,
So long lives this, and this gives life to thee."

So it will be with LC. He will live on through his songs. ( Probably long after this forum has ceased to exist.)
Forget your perfect offering -
There is a crack in everything...
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LisaLCFan
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Re: What's wrong with being a fan?

Postby LisaLCFan » Sat Oct 06, 2012 12:39 am

TipperaryAnn wrote:You ask, Lisa, whether Shakespeare would be famous if nobody had talked about him or written about him - the answer is YES! We know almost nothing about Shakespeare the man, ( except a few yarns about to whom he left his second best bed! ) but his "FANS" kept him alive - enough people loved his poems and his plays to pass them on to the next generation.
Okay, I'll give you that one! :D
sbreen
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Re: What's wrong with being a fan?

Postby sbreen » Sat Oct 06, 2012 1:47 am

Please.

Can't we just let everyone celebrate Leonard "in their different ways".

It seems a shame that some of those who enjoy the words and the music can't allow others to enjoy in their own way.

Enjoy the language.
Enjoy the music
Enjoy the tour.
Enjoy reading about other people's enjoyment.

(My 10c worth.)
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TipperaryAnn
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Re: What's wrong with being a fan?

Postby TipperaryAnn » Sat Oct 06, 2012 2:35 am

Thanks Lisa!

And you're right, Sbreen - we do. It's just that some of us enjoy debating as well! :)

(BTW if you look back you'll find that my original post was not critical of other's reactions to LC. It was a response to an attack on us "the fans" on the Verona thread. I just put it here because I think concert report threads should be about - concert reports.)
Forget your perfect offering -
There is a crack in everything...
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david birkett
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Re: What's wrong with being a fan?

Postby david birkett » Thu Oct 11, 2012 2:10 am

It may be the sad truth that, as in many internet fora and other spheres of life, some people have a need to define themselves as in some way more discerning, throroughbred and in some way 'genuine' than others. These others may then be looked down upon in order to enhance and affirm a sense of self-worth that's dependent on a perception of one's superiority, of feeling, as it were, 'Cohener than thou'.

It may, also, not be the case; I am a bit drunk as I write this.

Peace.
The Ogre does what ogres can,
Deeds quite impossible for Man,
But one prize is beyond his reach:
The Ogre cannot master speech.
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margaret
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Re: What's wrong with being a fan?

Postby margaret » Fri Oct 12, 2012 1:08 am

david birkett wrote:feeling, as it were, 'Cohener than thou'.

Nice one David!

Keep calm and Cohen on :)
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Re: What's wrong with being a fan?

Postby MaryB » Thu Oct 18, 2012 9:32 pm

Because of this forum, I have learned to overcome my 'obsessiveness', but I am still a 'fan' i.e., someone who appreciates LC's words and music.
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