Old Ideas in comparison....

Leonard Cohen's previous album (January 2012)
Vicomte
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Old Ideas in comparison....

Postby Vicomte » Wed Feb 29, 2012 8:19 pm

OH and I have listened to Old Ideas front to back and back to front and yes, it is a very good album, as one expects from L.C.

I have been reading some posts that it might in their opinion be his best, some of the songs are amongst his best, some will be classics and so on. And fair enough, everyone sees songs in their own way. I would not have thought that anyone has had their mind changed about a song they liked and been influenced enough to have it turn it into a dislike. Although I think we all do that for ourselves on occasion, for a short period, one plays a certain CD,or just one song from it until, one doesn't want to hear it for a long time after.

Anyway I digress, the point I am coming to is, I have been playing a few other albums by L.C and thought, goodness me, the competition to place any of the songs from Old Ideas in to say, a top 40 list of previous LC numbers would be tough. Here is a quick list I made of around 40 or so LC songs, that should show just how hard it would be to place something from the new album into. I am not knocking Old Idea before anyone thinks that, I am just putting it forward that it is all too easy in the headiness of a new LC album, to forget a little what has been before ;-)

These are those 40+ and I suspect I have missed several more.

The Window.
Anthem
Lover, Lover, Lover.
Seems So Long Ago, Nancy.
Take This Longing
Hallelujah.
Came So Far For Beauty
Democracy
A Singer Must Die
So long, Marianne.
Ain't No Cure For Love
Chelsea Hotel # 2
Suzanne
Famous Blue Raincoat
A Thousand kisses deep
If It Be Your Will.
Dance Me To The End Of Love
Joan Of Arc
Our Lady Of Solitude
Closing Time
In My Secret Life
Who by fire
Tonight Will Be Fine
One Of Us Cannot Be Wrong
First We Take Manhattan
Hey, That's No Way To Say Goodbye
Take This Longing
The Partisan
The Window
Everybody Knows
Alexandra Leaving
Bird On The Wire
That Don't Make It Junk
Coming Back To You
Famous Blue Raincoat
Heart With No Companion
I Can't Forget
Night Comes On
Sisters Of Mercy
Take This Waltz
The Stranger Song
Tower Of Song
You Know Who I Am
I guess it all started for me sometime around Christmas 1967 and now, goodness me, it's.........2017 and fifty years later.
No one ever listens to me. I might as well be a Leonard Cohen record.
Neil from The Young Ones
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LisaLCFan
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Re: Old Ideas in comparison....

Postby LisaLCFan » Wed Feb 29, 2012 8:57 pm

I have listened to other recordings of Leonard's simultaneously with Old Ideas--that is, I have an i-Pod setlist of LC studio albums, which I sometimes enjoy listening to in shuffle-mode (I listen to LC an awful lot--everything he has done--and I certianly, in no way, forget any of it). So, I have heard the Old Ideas songs back-to-back with other songs that I and many others would consider to be LC classics (including those in the list provided by Vicomte). As one of the people who has suggested that Old Ideas is one of Leonard's best albums, I still hold that view, particularly after hearing the Old Ideas songs in the mix with the rest. I think that they stand alongside the "classics" very well.

I am not trying to convince anyone else of my perception of Old Ideas, nor am I going to be swayed by the perceptions of others. I love the new album, I think it is great, and, there you have it! If other people are less enamoured of it, well, so be it. That will not diminish my enjoyment of it, nor my assessment of it.

Cheers!
Lisa
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Re: Old Ideas in comparison....

Postby gibjoe » Thu Mar 01, 2012 1:58 am

It is too soon to tell what Old Ideas place in the LC canon will be. Suffice to say the songs bear up well with earlier work and there is no sense of the creative juices being on a downward curve. Many other artists/groups seem to struggle to produce interesting new work after the age of 50 or so. Not our man.
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jerry
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Re: Old Ideas in comparison....

Postby jerry » Sat Mar 03, 2012 2:40 am

Every other LC album is better than Old Ideas except for Dear Heather. If Dear heather didn't exist then Old Ideas would be at the bottom of the list for me. But even at the bottom it's still a good album.
Poetry is just the evidence of life. If your life is burning well, poetry is just the ash.
Leonard Cohen
sbreen
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Re: Old Ideas in comparison....

Postby sbreen » Sat Mar 03, 2012 5:19 am

I listen to Cohen whenever I have free time (essential listening in the car)and it is on in the background while I am working at home.

I have every album, know all the lyrics really well and can sing along with most songs without error (bearing in mind that there are different lyrics and timing to songs - depending on which album they are on).

Note: I've been listening to him since 1970 when I was first introduced to 'Songs' so I have had plenty of time to become familiar with the lyrics and the timing of each track.)

[Dear Heather is often dismissed by fans - however 'the Letters' is a favourite track of mine and I always smile whenever I hear 'Because of'.]

Every album has at least one 'absolute favourite'.

I've found that the songs from Old Ideas have meshed neatly into place with the other songs and have found myself skipping through to the Old Ideas album as a starting place when I turn my player on.

The fact that it is now more likely the the song-on-my-lips as I wake up is from Old Ideas than any other album is the deciding factor for me.

This is a great album!
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TipperaryAnn
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Re: Old Ideas in comparison....

Postby TipperaryAnn » Sat Mar 03, 2012 12:03 pm

Vicomte wrote: ... the competition to place any of the songs from Old Ideas in to say, a top 40 list of previous LC numbers would be tough.
That is some impressive list, Vicomte. You've got most of my favourites there, give or take a few. But as was said on another thread they are not going to go away, we already have all those treasures. I'm just delighted to have a new album to consider with material that is different, varied, unexpected and adventurous in many ways.

It will take time to see how well it wears, of course, but even at this stage I would happily nominate "Amen" for any top 40 list - not a word or a note out of place there, I think.

By the way, you have "The Window" on your list twice, (no wonder - it is so gorgeous ) so there's a space available for "Amen" ! :D
Forget your perfect offering -
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MattW
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Re: Old Ideas in comparison....

Postby MattW » Sat Mar 03, 2012 5:55 pm

jerry wrote:Every other LC album is better than Old Ideas except for Dear Heather. If Dear heather didn't exist then Old Ideas would be at the bottom of the list for me. But even at the bottom it's still a good album.
The worst album he's ever done, IMO, is "Death Of a Ladies Man". And Mr. Cohen himself appearantly agrees with me.

Matt
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jerry
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Re: Old Ideas in comparison....

Postby jerry » Sat Mar 03, 2012 6:24 pm

MattW wrote:
jerry wrote:Every other LC album is better than Old Ideas except for Dear Heather. If Dear heather didn't exist then Old Ideas would be at the bottom of the list for me. But even at the bottom it's still a good album.
The worst album he's ever done, IMO, is "Death Of a Ladies Man". And Mr. Cohen himself appearantly agrees with me.

Matt
But the lyrics on Ladies Man beat out any of the lyrics on Old Ideas.
Poetry is just the evidence of life. If your life is burning well, poetry is just the ash.
Leonard Cohen
MattW
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Re: Old Ideas in comparison....

Postby MattW » Sat Mar 03, 2012 6:46 pm

jerry wrote:But the lyrics on Ladies Man beat out any of the lyrics on Old Ideas.
Are you stating this as fact or as your opinion?

Matt
Vicomte
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Re: Old Ideas in comparison....

Postby Vicomte » Sun Mar 04, 2012 2:02 am

TipperaryAnn wrote:
Vicomte wrote: ... the competition to place any of the songs from Old Ideas in to say, a top 40 list of previous LC numbers would be tough.
That is some impressive list, Vicomte. You've got most of my favourites there, give or take a few. But as was said on another thread they are not going to go away, we already have all those treasures. I'm just delighted to have a new album to consider with material that is different, varied, unexpected and adventurous in many ways.

It will take time to see how well it wears, of course, but even at this stage I would happily nominate "Amen" for any top 40 list - not a word or a note out of place there, I think.

By the way, you have "The Window" on your list twice, (no wonder - it is so gorgeous ) so there's a space available for "Amen" ! :D
Well spotted *Wilson, OK bung Amen in and take The Window 2 out ;-) :D

As some may know, my favourite backing singers over the years have been Julia and Perla (Yes just a tad above Jennifer Warnes) but doesn't Sharon do an excellent, probably unbeatable job on Banjo? Just to add something different, two people recently have told me that Lullaby is now their choice of song for their funeral :shock: ;-)

I do think the reason people might be having the songs from the new Album on their lips a lot of the time, more so than the older classics, is quite simply because it is fresh and it is new and I am no different, for the moment, it is songs from O.I that are in my head (and it's still in our car CD player :D ). As gibjoe said earlier, it is too soon to know how Old Ideas will fit in with LC's previous works.

* Wilson is a character from Dads Army for those not au fait with this classic British TV programme ;-)
I guess it all started for me sometime around Christmas 1967 and now, goodness me, it's.........2017 and fifty years later.
No one ever listens to me. I might as well be a Leonard Cohen record.
Neil from The Young Ones
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TipperaryAnn
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Re: Old Ideas in comparison....

Postby TipperaryAnn » Sun Mar 11, 2012 2:46 am

Vicomte wrote: two people recently have told me that Lullaby is now their choice of song for their funeral :shock: ;-)
Not surprised - lonesome yet comforting and very suitable for the long sleep...


"Going Home", despite its title, would hardly suit - "going home behind the curtain" would certainly be appropriate for a cremation, but if it were played in a church the phrase "lazy bastard" might not go down too well with some clergypersons! :roll:
Forget your perfect offering -
There is a crack in everything...
Vicomte
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Re: Old Ideas in comparison....

Postby Vicomte » Sun Mar 11, 2012 6:43 pm

"Going Home", despite its title, would hardly suit - "going home behind the curtain" would certainly be appropriate for a cremation, but if it were played in a church the phrase "lazy bastard" might not go down too well with some clergypersons! :roll:

:lol: :lol:

No, guess you are right there ;-)
I guess it all started for me sometime around Christmas 1967 and now, goodness me, it's.........2017 and fifty years later.
No one ever listens to me. I might as well be a Leonard Cohen record.
Neil from The Young Ones
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jerry
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Re: Old Ideas in comparison....

Postby jerry » Thu Mar 15, 2012 11:50 pm

MattW wrote:
jerry wrote:But the lyrics on Ladies Man beat out any of the lyrics on Old Ideas.
Are you stating this as fact or as your opinion?

Matt
Wouldn't it have to be my opnion if I'm saying it?
Poetry is just the evidence of life. If your life is burning well, poetry is just the ash.
Leonard Cohen
AlexandraLaughing
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Re: Old Ideas in comparison....

Postby AlexandraLaughing » Mon Feb 02, 2015 9:57 pm

Hmmm, as a new listener I would put many of the songs on Old Ideas ahead of a number of the songs on this Top 40 list, fabulous though many of them are. (I notice that there are no songs from 'Dear Heather' on that list, not even The Letters or The Faith, both of which I would think are candidates.) Here are some incendiary proposed excisions.

I would throw off:

Anthem. I know everyone loves this, but I find it just a bit too obvious. I would replace it with Come Healing, which does the same job, only better.
So Long, Marianne. I know everyone loves this too, but just how long can you keep singing about your sadness that your last ex but 27 decided it was over at around the same time you couldn't decide whether to leave her or not? I just can't get into the story of this song. I prefer Crazy to Love You.
Chelsea Hotel # 2. World's most over-celebrated blow-job. Replace it with Different Sides.
One Of Us Cannot Be Wrong. OK, it's fun- but it's not up to The Darkness.
Hey, That's No Way To Say Goodbye. Quickie number 43 in a series of 4003. OK, it's got some good lines, but it could happily make room for Lullaby.
That Don't Make It Junk. I like this song. But not as much as Going Home.
Tower of Song. Again, a very popular one, but I'd rather have Banjo.
I Can't Forget. Again, fun, but it's getting bumped in favour in of Show Me the Place.

There.

I agree Anyhow is not one of the 40 best LC songs, but everything else on the album is.
Vicomte
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Re: Old Ideas in comparison....

Postby Vicomte » Wed Feb 04, 2015 3:54 pm

Dare I say that I believe you have not attended a Cohen concert?

If that is the case, believe me those songs you are taking out would cause a few aficionados to choke on their setlists if Leonard toured again and were replaced for the ones you suggested.

Classic songs are just that, they are classics for a very good reason.
I guess it all started for me sometime around Christmas 1967 and now, goodness me, it's.........2017 and fifty years later.
No one ever listens to me. I might as well be a Leonard Cohen record.
Neil from The Young Ones

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