Democracy...writing a paper

wholisticlife · Post by **wholisticlife** » Sun Nov 13, 2005 3:20 am

Hi Folks,

I am writing a paper on Leonard Cohen's "Democracy" and I am curious what you think of the lyrics, rhyming, rhythm.

I appreciate your feedback and welcome the good bad and the ugly.

Karl

peter danielsen · Post by **peter danielsen** » Wed Nov 23, 2005 1:46 am

It is quite amusing to see leftwing intellectuals claim that this song is anti-america, It is not.

Peter

tomsakic · Post by **tomsakic** » Wed Nov 23, 2005 11:45 am

But it can be read that way. That's art, the intended meaning can't be claimed by its author. Although - as much Leonard talked it's the praise of America as cradle of the best and the worst - his another quote, the one about how he must erase and vanish his own beliefs and personal opinions to achieve the artistic truth, speaks much more about his poetry and Leonard's greatness. He may be, as he said many times, "iner conservative", but his whole work, from Beautiful Losers and Flowers for Hitler to The Future, and "The Land of Plenty" and "Villanelle For Our Time", speak from very different position.

peter danielsen · Post by **peter danielsen** » Wed Nov 23, 2005 1:42 pm

I agree that he speaks from a very different position. This position however I think is not anti-america. I think one of the most important linies in "democracy" is "I love the country but I cannot stand the scene".
From a certain perspective you must love someone even though you don't have sympathy for her/him. There is a kind of love that goes beyond sympathy. This love is seldom recognized by ideologist.

Besides that, there is also lines like "It's here they got the range and the machinary for change, it's here they got the spiritual thirst", and "sail on sail on oh mighty ship of states". How could thís be understood as anti-america?

I guess that one could say that because of the different paradigms of the postmodern, or rather the modern, that any reading goes. However I think the works you mention, clearly are examples of an artform which warns against any ideology or at least shows what any ideology, be it political or on the inner level, has the tendency to raise persons to godlevel, and from that we know of the blodshed of history.

Peter

tomsakic · Post by **tomsakic** » Wed Nov 23, 2005 3:13 pm

peter danielsen wrote:I agree that he speaks from a very different position. This position however I think is not anti-america. I think one of the most important linies in "democracy" is "I love the country but I cannot stand the scene".

From a certain perspective you must love someone even though you don't have sympathy for her/him. There is a kind of love that goes beyond sympathy. This love is seldom recognized by ideologist.

I agree with you. This song is song about the love for America as symbol of democracy and open society, and, as you said it, the most important (and my favourite) line is "I love the country but I can't stand the scene". The ideologists really can't recognize this (real) kind of love, when you love something or someone in good and in bad. I presume they (ideologists) would equal this with "moral uncertainity" of "On That Day" ("I wouldn't know, I'm just holding the fort...").